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Speaker 1: I understand what it takes to scale. I spent my

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Speaker 1: formative years at an amazing company like Unilever. I call

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Speaker 1: myself a Unilever child. I was born and brought up there.

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Speaker 1: Everything that I know, I learned from them. But now

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Speaker 1: to be able to take that and flex that framework

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Speaker 1: to different sized businesses makes it interesting. And the reason

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Speaker 1: why I say 100 million plus is because by then

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Speaker 1: now you’re starting to get to serious levels of traction.

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Speaker 1: Your P & L is starting to generate a level

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Speaker 1: of marketing spend. which then is a very different level

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Speaker 1: of talent you need to be able to spend that

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Speaker 1: spend in a way that’s ROI generative and is driving

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Speaker 1: your sales through and productivity further.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to today’s episode of Brave Commerce.

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Speaker 3: I’m Rachel Typograph, the founder and CEO of Micmac.

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Speaker 2: I’m Sarah Hofstetter, president of Profitero.

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Speaker 4: And this is a show that talks about what’s relevant

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Speaker 4: in e-commerce for the world’s biggest brands.

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Speaker 3: Sarah, one of the.

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Speaker 5: Interesting things that I’m finding right now in consumer goods,

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Speaker 5: as well as the talent market that exists around consumer goods,

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Speaker 5: is just how much of the industry is moving towards PE.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, there’s a combination of where sourcing is

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Speaker 2: coming from, what are you currently accountable for? What’s been

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Speaker 2: really interesting to me about more of these PE-backed companies in,

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Speaker 2: call it packaged goods or companies that are selling through retailers,

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Speaker 2: is that it’s sexy again. but it is when you

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Speaker 2: have the financial fundamentals. It’s a double-edged sword. Like on

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Speaker 2: the one hand, you know, these companies are still in

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Speaker 2: high growth mode, but in order to be successful at that,

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Speaker 2: they need those really strong fundamentals, but they need something

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Speaker 2: different that’s gonna make them break through. And historically, when

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Speaker 2: we say historically, over the past, you know, five years ago,

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Speaker 2: D2C was the big yippee-ki-yay, and now it’s moving much

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Speaker 2: more to distribution.

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Speaker 3: Absolutely. I mean, all these brands have realized that Ultimately,

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Speaker 3: the direct-to-consumer business model is not profitable. They’re moving towards omnichannel.

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Speaker 3: But the other interesting thing on the talent side is,

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Speaker 3: and I think you and I have these sort of

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Speaker 3: backdoor conversations all the time, a lot of our customers

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Speaker 3: who have grown up in big public consumer goods companies

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Speaker 3: are very interested now in having a bite at the

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Speaker 3: apple working for a PE-backed organization.

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Speaker 2: Yes. And the big part of that comes from the

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Speaker 2: challenges in general working for big public companies is that

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Speaker 2: you often, obviously this isn’t for everyone, but in many instances,

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Speaker 2: you’re working to figure out your short-term gains so your

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Speaker 2: stock price doesn’t slide. And that can cause a lot

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Speaker 2: of unintended consequences. Whereas with PE, there are also you know,

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Speaker 2: short-term things you’ve got to hit, but you’re working against

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Speaker 2: more of a two-year plan and there isn’t as much

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Speaker 2: noise from the outside. And like you said, the potential

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Speaker 2: gains are that much greater based on time to exit, right?

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Speaker 3: Absolutely.

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Speaker 4: Someone who fits that mold is our friend, Osh, who

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Speaker 4: has come from big consumer goods companies like Unilever and

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Speaker 4: Revlon and is now taking a bite of the apple

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Speaker 4: at a Bain Capital portfolio of beauty brands.

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Speaker 3: So I think on that note, let’s hear how it’s

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Speaker 3: going for her and bring her onto the show.

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Speaker 2: Today, we are so happy to have Oshia Savor. who

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Speaker 2: is Chief Brand Officer at Mesa, which encompasses a lot

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Speaker 2: of brands. We’re going to get into the Knit Tea

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Speaker 2: Grit Tea. Thank you so much for joining us. Really

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Speaker 2: appreciate it.

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Speaker 1: My pleasure. Thank you for having me.

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Speaker 2: There’s a lot to unpack. You guys are the number

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Speaker 2: one beauty incubator in masks. People may not know the

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Speaker 2: Mesa brand, but they probably know a lot of the

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Speaker 2: brands that are sitting within your portfolio. Do you mind

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Speaker 2: breaking it down as if I’m a fifth grader for

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Speaker 2: the context of what does it mean to be a

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Speaker 2: beauty incubator? And then what are the brands and how

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Speaker 2: do they have a place in the world?

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Speaker 1: Sounds good. You know, you’re the only other person who

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Speaker 1: brings a question like that. I always say a two

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Speaker 1: year old. I think a fifth grader is a better person.

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Speaker 1: Way to go at it because a two-year-old will not

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Speaker 1: comprehend anything told to them. But to answer the question,

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Speaker 1: we think of, not think of, but incubator is really

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Speaker 1: what it sounds like. It’s what we do for a

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Speaker 1: living is create brands. And while this business model started

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Speaker 1: with just creating brands, now we’ve become a company that

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Speaker 1: has a portfolio of brands. So not only are we

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Speaker 1: creating brands, but we have a stable of brands that

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Speaker 1: have scaled and are therefore scaling the brand. So it’s

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Speaker 1: almost like two capabilities being built, right? One that is

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Speaker 1: to find a sleepy giant brand CPG category that has

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Speaker 1: been declining or is in a perpetual state of tons

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Speaker 1: of meaningless innovation. So our job is to go in,

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Speaker 1: disrupt that market, find that white space, consumer unmet need,

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Speaker 1: and create a meaningful brand for that. Or we have

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Speaker 1: brands that already exist in very competitive categories like hair

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Speaker 1: and really scale those brands and go at it like that.

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Speaker 1: And my current role, which I’ve like self coined my

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Speaker 1: title as chief brand and marketing officer, because it is

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Speaker 1: interval that encompasses both. But I do cut across all

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Speaker 1: of our creative and innovation, basically all of the incubation

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Speaker 1: and innovation that we do for the company. But then

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Speaker 1: on top of that, all the brand marketing efforts, all

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Speaker 1: the press, influencer and social and the marketing operations that

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Speaker 1: lead into creating those beautiful brands and scaling them. That

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Speaker 1: is sort of the breadth of the portfolio. We’ve got,

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Speaker 1: my God, about seven to eight meaningful brands. four of

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Speaker 1: those brands are already greater than $ 50 million in POS.

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Speaker 1: One of our brands is crossing $ 200 million in retail sales,

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Speaker 1: one other 100 million plus. So you think of an

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Speaker 1: incubator and you think about small brands, but actually what’s

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Speaker 1: so beautiful about Mesa is that we are scaling brands,

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Speaker 1: have scaled brands, and then continue to innovate and bring

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Speaker 1: it new.

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Speaker 3: It’s really cool, the diversity. And the diversity isn’t just

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Speaker 3: in size, but also from our understanding, distribution channels as well.

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Speaker 3: Some of them are pure direct-to-consumers. Others, you went to

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Speaker 3: one retailer. Others have more mass distribution. When you think

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Speaker 3: about all these models, do you have a preference? What

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Speaker 3: do you see as the pros and cons? Is the

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Speaker 3: goal to get everyone to be mass distributed? Just would

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Speaker 3: love to hear how you think about distribution.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, no, sure. Direct-to-consumer, we used to have, and increasingly

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Speaker 1: we don’t currently invest in a direct-to-consumer model. The unit

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Speaker 1: economics have made sense for us. Typically, I find that

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Speaker 1: in mass, your products you’re shipping are so heavy that

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Speaker 1: And your price points are not that high. So the

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Speaker 1: direct-to-consumer model tends to get very tricky. So unless there’s

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Speaker 1: a real need for your business to have first-party data,

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Speaker 1: it’s a hard one from a profit standpoint to really justify.

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Speaker 1: Having said that, I come from Prestige. And in Prestige,

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Speaker 1: I had very skilled D2C businesses because it made a

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Speaker 1: ton of sense. My price points commanded the margin that

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Speaker 1: would be required to do D2C right. Now, coming back

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Speaker 1: to sort of the MESA model, what we call is

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Speaker 1: sort of the trifecta of success that we have. One,

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Speaker 1: first and foremost, is finding that unmet consumer need, right?

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Speaker 1: Quite often, when I was in large CPGs, you tend

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Speaker 1: to not launch things in declining categories because to turn

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Speaker 1: around the fate of a declining category is very, very tricky.

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Speaker 1: It’s very hard. But that becomes the playground for me.

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Speaker 1: So it’s a very counterintuitive model is to say when

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Speaker 1: something’s declining is when we’re like, ooh, this is exciting.

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Speaker 1: Let’s go disrupt this. Why is it declining? Finding that

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Speaker 1: consumer need. But not only does it stop there, that’s

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Speaker 1: the first part of the mix is finding the consumer need.

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Speaker 1: And then we have a really strong competency in design

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Speaker 1: and branding. So as you see, all of the brands

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Speaker 1: that Mesa has, they’re very beautifully aesthetically designed. And so

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Speaker 1: when you find them in a mass channel, you’re almost

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Speaker 1: surprised and delighted because you don’t expect that in that channel.

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Speaker 1: So it’s very elevated. look and feel and the price

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Speaker 1: point that feels just right in a surprise and delight moment.

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Speaker 1: But a critical part of this recipe is the retailer partnerships.

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Speaker 1: It is very, very important that we find a partner

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Speaker 1: who believes in the vision and this unmet consumer need, right?

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Speaker 1: So it almost always takes a leap of faith from

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Speaker 1: the retailer as well to say, yes, we believe that

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Speaker 1: this category is due for a renovation and Mesa, you

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Speaker 1: are the partner who will help us bring it to life.

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Speaker 1: So oftentimes our model actually starts with an exclusive for

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Speaker 1: that reason. We find a retailer partner who shares our

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Speaker 1: vision or our thought partners with us, and therefore work

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Speaker 1: together to build and nurture that brand. And you both

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Speaker 1: are in brand building as well. You know that a brand,

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Speaker 1: a beautiful brand is not built overnight. It takes a

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Speaker 1: lot of investment and a lot of consistency of messaging

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Speaker 1: to bring it out in that way. So retailers play

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Speaker 1: an extremely important role. So our model often starts with exclusives.

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Speaker 1: And it’s only after the brand has achieved a certain

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Speaker 1: level of scale and in close partnership with our retailers,

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Speaker 1: we decide together that it’s time to bring this brand

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Speaker 1: to a wider distribution. We do that. Lastly, you know,

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Speaker 1: it’s also about the marketing that goes behind these brands.

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Speaker 1: It’s a very different business model, right? You’re not playing

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Speaker 1: with $ 100 million in advertising budgets. You are playing with

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Speaker 1: a very different budget in a business model. And so

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Speaker 1: what we do is we focus a lot on brand heat.

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Speaker 1: a lot of organic heat, a lot of influencer-led heat,

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Speaker 1: and a lot of social media-driven heat. Because what we

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Speaker 1: believe is when your brand is just right, people want

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Speaker 1: to talk about it. And when people want to talk

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Speaker 1: about it, you have higher ROI because anything divided by

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Speaker 1: zero isn’t finite, right? So we go for organic, we

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Speaker 1: go for authentic content. And of course we invest with paid,

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Speaker 1: but our number one focus for all of our brands

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Speaker 1: is to build that organic love and organic brand heat

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Speaker 1: at launch.

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Speaker 3: So like when you think about the marketing mix for

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Speaker 3: these brands, especially, you know, a lot of our listeners

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Speaker 3: come from these more legacy organizations. How much is going

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Speaker 3: towards influencer versus search? versus paid social? Like, how do

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Speaker 3: you think of that mix? Just like ballpark guidance.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I would say a very high, I would say

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Speaker 1: majority of our attention is going into influencer. Yeah. It’s

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Speaker 1: all about finding that authentic brand story. Because I genuinely

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Speaker 1: believe when your content is right and it’s not paid,

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Speaker 1: when it’s organic and it’s authentic, people see through that.

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Speaker 1: And especially actually this morning, I was reading an article

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Speaker 1: about how on TikTok now there is so much paid

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Speaker 1: content being put out there. Consumers are starting to become

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Speaker 1: wary of this real looking content, but actually it’s a

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Speaker 1: spark ad, right? So people are starting to see that

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Speaker 1: as a red flag. And so as a brand marketer,

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Speaker 1: you have to be very careful in terms of how

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Speaker 1: you’re seeding your brand story and product. And the real

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Speaker 1: magic truly happens when something goes viral. That’s when, and

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Speaker 1: if you’re able to sustain that virality is when your

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Speaker 1: run rates trigger into a different level altogether. If you’re

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Speaker 1: at a larger CPG and you’re working off of a

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Speaker 1: $ 500 million retail sales brand with, I don’t know, 30, 40,

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Speaker 1: $ 50 million in advertising budgets, I think it would be

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Speaker 1: a very different mix. You know, it wouldn’t be the

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Speaker 1: entire same mix and it would be very much top

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Speaker 1: down in terms of how you build your awareness.

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Speaker 2: Got it. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Does influencer for you mean TikTok, Instagram, YouTube today? Or

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Speaker 3: are there other channels where you feel influencers are living?

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Speaker 1: I think for now, those are the ones that have scaled.

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Speaker 1: Those are the ones where the eyeballs are. And I

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Speaker 1: would say TikTok increasingly is a pillar for everyone. But

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Speaker 1: I think Instagram remains very relevant. That’s where the traffic is.

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Speaker 1: That’s where a very large percentage of people are. Similarly

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Speaker 1: for YouTube, it depends on what type of content you’re

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Speaker 1: looking for. If it’s a long-form content where you’re teaching

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Speaker 1: and educating somebody on something, that’s likely YouTube. When it’s entertainment,

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Speaker 1: it’s more TikTok. But also these days, especially with Gen Z,

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Speaker 1: a lot of the search behavior is starting on TikTok too.

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Speaker 1: So I think it really boils down to what you’re

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Speaker 1: trying to achieve for the brand and which channel makes

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Speaker 1: the most sense. But those would be the three, I

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Speaker 1: would say.

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Speaker 2: So going deeper into channels, I really like the way

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Speaker 2: that you’re thinking about the exclusivity at the retailer level scaling.

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Speaker 2: D2C also has a heck of a lot of allure.

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Speaker 2: When you think about the volume of data, retail distribution

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Speaker 2: gets the eyeballs in traffic. So as you think through

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Speaker 2: that entire mix of your relationships with your retailers, when

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Speaker 2: a brand is ready to scale, the relationship of where

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Speaker 2: and how you consider the consumer journey, how do you

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Speaker 2: think about the D2C model versus the Omni model as

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Speaker 2: you think about each of the brands that you’re incubating?

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Speaker 1: You know, as I was saying, we on direct-to-consumer don’t

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Speaker 1: currently play effective in a major way. Having said that,

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Speaker 1: we are experimenting with TikTok shop quite a bit. Now,

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Speaker 1: TikTok shop is not the same as D2C. You don’t

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Speaker 1: have the first-party data, so it doesn’t quite get into

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Speaker 1: exactly the heart of what a D2C channel would do

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Speaker 1: for you. But I love the idea of being able

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Speaker 1: to do affiliate influencer and really incentivizing people to create content.

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Speaker 1: So very content-first mindset into driving sales. I really love

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Speaker 1: that about TikTok shops. In certain brands, Where we are national,

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Speaker 1: we are experimenting with TikTok shop. But for the most part,

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Speaker 1: as I was saying before, retailer partnerships and thought leadership

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Speaker 1: is an extremely critical part of how we go to market.

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Speaker 1: So in the years that we’re exclusive to them, absolutely

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Speaker 1: all of our energy goes into driving traffic to the channel.

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Speaker 1: So even when we have the websites, those websites do

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Speaker 1: drive traffic. to the priority retailer and drive that sort

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Speaker 1: of buzz and knowledge within the retailer environment.

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Speaker 3: So are you willing to put a flag in the

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Speaker 3: sand and say direct-to-consumer is dead?

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Speaker 2: No, no, no, no. Nice try, Rach. Nice try.

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Speaker 1: Very nice try. No, absolutely not. You know, I have

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Speaker 1: firmly believed and I have believed this for a number

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Speaker 1: of years at this point in time because I have

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Speaker 1: moved between prestige and masks and all different kinds of

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Speaker 1: personal care and beauty. And everybody tries to pin it

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Speaker 1: down into yes or no in a black and white territory.

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Speaker 1: And quite honestly, there isn’t ever one size fits all answer.

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Speaker 1: And it really depends on what you’re trying to do

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Speaker 1: with your brand. I think if direct-to-consumer model is important

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Speaker 1: for you because first-party data is important to you, or

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Speaker 1: you’re trying to create more innovation timeframes within the year,

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Speaker 1: And you’re not able to do that with the retailers

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Speaker 1: because they have very set planograms and you’re not able

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Speaker 1: to create bus, for instance, color cosmetics. We know innovation

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Speaker 1: is the name of the game. You have to keep

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Speaker 1: up with the trends. You have to keep launching lots

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Speaker 1: of slow MOQ, small ticket items. Not everything needs to

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Speaker 1: go to the retailers because the cost of failure at

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Speaker 1: a scale of retailer is very, very high for a brand.

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Speaker 1: So something like that would be right for direct-to-consumer. You’ve

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Speaker 1: created a community. These are people who love your brand.

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Speaker 1: Here is where you launch your limited editions. If your

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Speaker 1: limited edition is successful, now you have a proven business case.

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Speaker 1: You take it to a retailer and you actually scale

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Speaker 1: that launch, right? Like that could make a ton of sense.

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Speaker 1: Whereas you have a shampoo conditioner, it’s a core product.

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Speaker 1: It’s heavy to ship. And the first party data that

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Speaker 1: you’re getting is not that valuable because the kind of

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Speaker 1: targeting you’re able to do with Facebook, Instagram is good enough.

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Speaker 1: And plus, You can get widgets like Micmac and work

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Speaker 1: on retailer.coms and get better value of information, right? And

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Speaker 1: you can get by with a pretty strong media campaign.

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Speaker 1: So you don’t really have the need for first-party data

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Speaker 1: in the way that you would for something else. So

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Speaker 1: I think it really boils down to what the brand

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Speaker 1: needs are, where your profit margins are, what your price

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Speaker 1: points are, what’s the role of each of the channel

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Speaker 1: within your portfolio. And then you go craft it from there.

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Speaker 1: But I’d be silly to say it’s dead game over

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Speaker 1: for D2C. It really isn’t.

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Speaker 3: I appreciate that you don’t have black and white thinking

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Speaker 3: like me.

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Speaker 2: Well, I think there’s a little bit more. Rachel, you’re

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Speaker 2: the last person with black and white thinking. If I

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Speaker 2: want to talk about like color, you’ve got a lot

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Speaker 2: of color. You know, one of the things that I

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Speaker 2: find fascinating about everything that you’ve said right now is

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Speaker 2: about finding that Goldilocks moment, like something not too big,

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Speaker 2: not too small. What is the just right for each

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Speaker 2: one of those brands? And I think about the big,

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Speaker 2: small component about you going from Unilever, one of the

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Speaker 2: biggest companies in the world, to a slightly smaller company,

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Speaker 2: but more focused company in Revlon, then to a smaller

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Speaker 2: one in Charlotte Tilbury, but at a much more senior level.

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Speaker 2: And now you are in the C-suite as chief brand officer,

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Speaker 2: chief marketing officer across this beautiful portfolio of brands. What

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Speaker 2: is your Goldilocks? What’s the right size company for you

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Speaker 2: as an individual and why?

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Speaker 1: I wish I could answer that question. And I feel

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Speaker 1: that whenever I say never, I will put a flag

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Speaker 1: in the sand. The universe conspires and makes it happen

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Speaker 1: to be the opposite. So I would be wary to

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Speaker 1: put a flag in the sand. But I do find

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Speaker 1: that a superpower that I have realized over the number

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Speaker 1: of years now, having progressively gone to smaller and smaller

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Speaker 1: scale companies, because I I understand what it takes to scale.

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Speaker 1: I spent my formative years at an amazing company like Unilever.

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Speaker 1: I call myself a Unilever child. I was born and

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Speaker 1: brought up there. Everything that I know, I learned from them.

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Speaker 1: But now to be able to take that and flex

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Speaker 1: that framework to different sized businesses makes it interesting. So

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Speaker 1: I think someone like me would fit within that framework

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Speaker 1: really nicely because you bring in the best of both

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Speaker 1: the worlds, right? Being able to be scrappy, roll up

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Speaker 1: your sleeves, think about small media budgets, but also at

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Speaker 1: the same time, have the framework of what good looks like.

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Speaker 1: So then you’re able to see what the destination is

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Speaker 1: almost very clearly, versus if you’re just born from that

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Speaker 1: $ 0 mindset, trying to save up every dollar, trying to

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Speaker 1: run after every opportunity, sometimes you lose that sense of

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Speaker 1: prioritization and what will take it to continue to scale further.

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Speaker 3: When you think about some of your peers, And a

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Speaker 3: lot of people are thinking about, hey, I’ve just spent

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Speaker 3: my life at, you know, big FMCG. Maybe I want

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Speaker 3: to go to a PE back company. This whole, like,

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Speaker 3: how much do you have to roll up your sleeves?

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Speaker 3: All of a sudden, you have a team to do

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Speaker 3: blank or an agency partner to do blank. Like, where

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Speaker 3: do you feel like that learning curve is and how

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Speaker 3: hands-on you might need to be at a company that’s doing,

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Speaker 3: you know, $ 100 to $ 500 million in revenue?

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Speaker 1: It’s an interesting question, right? I think at the end

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Speaker 1: of the day, you decide who you’re going to be

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Speaker 1: and how much rolling up the sleeves you’re going to

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Speaker 1: allow yourselves to do versus letting your teams also run

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Speaker 1: with it, right? But sometimes you find if you’re especially

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Speaker 1: coming from very large scale businesses, you become very subject

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Speaker 1: matter expert because there’s so many other teams who are

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Speaker 1: managing every little bit of it, right? So you become

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Speaker 1: a subject matter expert and you’ve had so much help

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Speaker 1: around you and infrastructure that supports you, right? So when

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Speaker 1: you pluck yourself out of that infrastructure and you throw

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Speaker 1: yourself on the deep end, you’re like, oh my God,

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Speaker 1: half the things that others were doing for me, now

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Speaker 1: I have to do myself, right? So you have to

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Speaker 1: learn on the job very quickly and you can’t find

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Speaker 1: an agency partner because you’re now debating between non-working dollars

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Speaker 1: paid to an agency versus you just spending that extra

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Speaker 1: two hours in the day and learning how to do it, right?

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Speaker 1: And working versus not working, my thought is always to

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Speaker 1: go for working, right? Because that’s productivity of dollars, not

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Speaker 1: to say never no to agency because of course they

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Speaker 1: add very specific subject matter expertise as well. So I

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Speaker 1: think it really boils down to a person’s appetite. I

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Speaker 1: personally really enjoy rolling up my sleeves, learning new things,

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Speaker 1: rolling with the punches, trying out new things, failing fast,

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Speaker 1: learning new and sort of like just going with it.

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Speaker 1: That sort of kind of fires me up. You know,

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Speaker 1: I kind of don’t like when I have so much

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Speaker 1: support that I can’t think freely and creatively and have

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Speaker 1: to convince 10 other people before something can be done.

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Speaker 1: So I really, really enjoy it. to just run with it.

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Speaker 1: Like what I love about where I’m at me too,

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Speaker 1: oftentimes I’m the decision maker. So my teams have direct

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Speaker 1: line of contact with me. My brand manager, oh my God, oh,

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Speaker 1: this thing going viral. I have this amazing idea. Can

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Speaker 1: I run with it? Yeah, go run with it. What’s

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Speaker 1: the worst that can happen?

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Speaker 2: We’ll fail.

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Speaker 1: We’ll pivot fast and do something else, right? So I

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Speaker 1: think that’s been great. And Mesa is a Bain portfolio company.

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Speaker 1: We’re owned by Bain Capital. They’ve been great partners with

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Speaker 1: us too. I think they’re really believing in the vision

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Speaker 1: that we’re bringing to this company as well as we

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Speaker 1: professionalize it, get it ready for its next growth stage.

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Speaker 1: So it’s very, very exciting.

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Speaker 3: Well, we have to ask you our famous last question,

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Speaker 3: which is what’s the bravest thing you’ve ever done?

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Speaker 1: So I grew up in India my whole life and

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Speaker 1: actually had my first job starting at Hindustan Libre in India.

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00:20:32,680 –> 00:20:36,080
Speaker 1: And there, the way they develop leaders of the future

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Speaker 1: is we are mandated to cut across swim lanes. We

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Speaker 1: are supposed to do brand building, then brand development, global

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Speaker 1: marketing roles, and cut across different levels. So when I

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Speaker 1: moved to America in 2010, that was the biggest change

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Speaker 1: in career development I found myself forced into a swim lane.

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Speaker 1: And I was supposed to be becoming really good at it,

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Speaker 1: but I had one thing, and that was where I

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Speaker 1: was going to spend the rest of my life. And

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Speaker 1: I found that to be a very confining experience, and

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Speaker 1: I wasn’t okay with it. So I think the bravest

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Speaker 1: thing that I did was to continue to challenge it.

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Speaker 1: and really force myself to swim across swim lanes and

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Speaker 1: not let someone else’s design career path define me and

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Speaker 1: who I was going to be. So I have really

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Speaker 1: enjoyed going between masks and prestige, between global marketing and

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Speaker 1: brand building roles, P & L roles, e-comm versus non-e-comm.

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Speaker 1: And now at this point in time where I sit

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Speaker 1: in my current role, I’m doing innovation. I’m doing brand marketing.

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Speaker 1: I’m doing digital marketing strategies. I’m doing marketing operations, et cetera,

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Speaker 1: et cetera, right? And cutting between hair care to color

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Speaker 1: cosmetics to fragrances and to maybe God knows what other

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Speaker 1: category we will launch next, right? So I think what

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Speaker 1: I find so exciting now is that all of this

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Speaker 1: wasn’t in vain. All the last 15 years of turmoil

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Speaker 1: and pushing myself and proving myself constantly. And when everybody

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Speaker 1: said no, I said, hell yes, now I’m going to

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Speaker 1: show you I’m going to actually cut across the swim lane.

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Speaker 1: So it’s very rewarding now because now I sit in

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Speaker 1: my position and I can seamlessly go from one thing

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Speaker 1: to the other and not even realize that I’m doing it.

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Speaker 1: So I I’m grateful for every one person who… Hi,

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Speaker 1: I’m Jackie Cooper, Global Chief Brand Officer at Edelman and

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Speaker 1: the host of Touch of Truth, a new podcast.

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Speaker 2: Launching on the Adweek Podcast Network. My dad gave me

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Speaker 2: this incredibly smart piece of advice.

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Speaker 1: Meet everyone once. As a result, I’ve met some of

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Speaker 1: the most fascinating and inspiring people on the planet. Now

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Speaker 1: on Touch of Truth, we’re coming centre stage and sharing

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Speaker 1: the mic to experience stories of truth, insights and visions

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Speaker 1: for the future that.

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Speaker 2: Will challenge your way of thinking.

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Speaker 1: Touch of Truth is available wherever you listen to podcasts.

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Speaker 1: New episodes come out every Tuesday. I do hope to

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Speaker 1: see you there.