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Speaker 1: Risk tolerance cannot be applied as a one-size-fits-all, right? You

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Speaker 1: have to consider the maturity and resiliency of a brand,

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Speaker 1: the health of a category, and also the retailer’s willingness.

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Speaker 2: They have to be willing to take risks with you.

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Speaker 1: And then, of course, the size and importance of any

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Speaker 1: given brand or business to a company’s P & L.

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Speaker 1: So with the portfolio I run now, with P & L, six,

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Speaker 1: seven distinct segments. You cannot take six or seven big risks, right?

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Speaker 1: You have to balance your risk-taking with having safety nets

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Speaker 1: and I’ll call them sure bets. So in a nutshell,

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Speaker 1: I’ve now figured out how to articulate my remit is

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Speaker 1: really around smart risk-taking.

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Speaker 3: Welcome to today’s episode of Free of Commerce.

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Speaker 2: I’m Sarah Hofstadter.

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Speaker 4: And I’m Rachel Tippegraff. And this is a show that

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Speaker 4: talks about what’s relevant in commerce for the world’s biggest brands. Sarah,

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Speaker 4: we obviously spend a lot of time within CPG, and

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Speaker 4: it feels like in some ways.

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Speaker 2: The gap between.

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Speaker 4: challenger brands and the incumbents are widening for a multitude

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Speaker 4: of reasons. But, you know, from my perspective, also, especially

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Speaker 4: since joining Spin since the acquisition, is that the challenger

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Speaker 4: brands are just designed to innovate. And it’s much more

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Speaker 4: difficult for large CPGs to bring product innovation to market.

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Speaker 3: Well, I mean, it goes back to book by Lou Gerstner,

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Speaker 3: who says elephants can’t dance. It’s very hard for big

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Speaker 3: companies to move nimbly. And so innovate or die is

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Speaker 3: a requirement for disruptors. Bigger companies, it’s innovate or die

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Speaker 3: a slow death, I guess, versus just cold halves, which is,

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Speaker 3: this is just terribly depressing. But taking this back to

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Speaker 3: the podcast, it requires a certain degree of bravery to

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Speaker 3: within big companies to take big swings because whether it’s

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Speaker 3: innovation or whether it’s marketing, any big swing that you

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Speaker 3: take could be an epic flop and you could be

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Speaker 3: a brand caretaker without being a brand leader.

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Speaker 4: And the reality is, is that step change innovation is

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Speaker 4: what wins. Like you can’t take baby steps anymore.

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Speaker 3: Well, you know, the whole new and improved Starburst you

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Speaker 3: can put on a product that will only get you

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Speaker 3: so far. And in fact, some argue that when you

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Speaker 3: do that, it creates negative effect for sleep shoppers. So

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Speaker 3: the question is, what do you do?

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Speaker 4: The number one thing that you have to do is

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Speaker 4: keep moving. Inertia is what will kill you.

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Speaker 2: Yes.

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Speaker 3: But I would posit you also have to be comfortable

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Speaker 3: taking risk, like risking like a start of risks, because

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Speaker 3: big companies used to be able to outspend.

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Speaker 2: But the nimble ones.

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Speaker 3: Are out hustling. So the question is, what kind of

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Speaker 3: a big swing can you take? And do you have

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Speaker 3: enough downside protection on the risk-taking to be able to

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Speaker 3: do it? I mean, back in the day, and this

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Speaker 3: is really back in the day when I worked on

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Speaker 3: Oreo and we did the Gay Pride social media post,

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Speaker 3: which is hilarious that that was risk-taking back then, but

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Speaker 3: yet it was. I got a phone call from somebody

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Speaker 3: very senior at the company telling me how much risk

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Speaker 3: I put to the business by doing that. And I’m like,

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Speaker 3: I was just the agency, like the agency got approval. Like,

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Speaker 3: I don’t know why you’re yelling at me, but the

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Speaker 3: brand teams, they got their wrist slap for taking swings.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: A hundred percent.

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Speaker 3: What brand of the model is portfolio is more iconic

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Speaker 3: than Ori? Because they take big swings now. And, and

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Speaker 3: I think that’s, that’s what.

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Speaker 4: Leaders have to do.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: I mean, another place to look is my alma mater.

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Speaker 4: Look at what Richard Dixon is doing right now at Gap.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah.

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Speaker 4: I mean, he has, revitalize that brand that hasn’t been

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Speaker 4: that way since essentially the 90s.

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Speaker 2: But he took big swings.

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Speaker 4: He’s only taking big swings and he’s executing flawlessly.

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Speaker 3: Shout out to our friend Pam Kauffman, former BraveCon alum

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Speaker 3: and friend of the two of us.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Chief Venture Canin officer over there making some moves.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, absolutely. But bringing it back to who we’re about

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Speaker 4: to bring on the show, we’ve had folks over the

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Speaker 4: years from Campbell’s join us. And we all know that

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Speaker 4: Sarah Hofstadter is on the board, my co-host of Campbell’s.

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Speaker 4: But there is a rock star leader who came through

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Speaker 4: an acquisition who is leading the meals and beverage business.

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Speaker 4: And once you hear from her, you will see how

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Speaker 4: she is truly a change agent to risk taking within

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Speaker 4: this larger organization. So without further ado, let’s bring Risa

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Speaker 4: onto the show.

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Speaker 3: We are happy to have Rita Critella, EVP of Meals

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Speaker 3: and Beverages at The Campbell’s Company. That is a mouthful,

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Speaker 3: but bottom line, you are the uber boss on all

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Speaker 3: things meals and beverages at Campbell’s, am I right?

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Speaker 1: It’s a wonderful role, and I’m privileged to have it.

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Speaker 1: I’m privileged to be here with the two of you,

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Speaker 1: and greetings to the Brave Commerce audience.

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Speaker 3: Thanks so much for joining us. You and I first

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Speaker 3: met via the acquisition by Campbell’s of Rao’s when you

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Speaker 3: were leading a whole bunch of work there, and I

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Speaker 3: fell in love with you instantly. I was like, seriously fangirling.

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Speaker 3: And now it’s just awesome to see you leading the

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Speaker 3: entire M & B division. One of the challenges, though,

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Speaker 3: is when you go from such an entrepreneurial environment to,

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Speaker 3: let’s just say, a bigger beast, if you will. It’s

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Speaker 3: hard to figure out how to bring the best of

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Speaker 3: the best of the entrepreneurship while still handling the scale

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Speaker 3: and diversity of brands and all the other stuff that

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Speaker 3: you have to work with at Campbell’s. So what might

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Speaker 3: be some of the things that you can bring from

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Speaker 3: an entrepreneurial spirit? And what are the things that just

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Speaker 3: don’t scale?

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Speaker 1: Yes. When I first joined the Campbell’s organization, as you mentioned,

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Speaker 1: via the acquisition, I was being positively bombarded with these

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Speaker 1: questions around Risa. Like, how do we adopt the growth

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Speaker 1: mindset from your entrepreneurial experience, from what we know is

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Speaker 1: very common in and contributes greatly to the success of

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Speaker 1: insurgent brands. And I find myself playing along like, okay, sure,

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Speaker 1: let’s talk about the growth mindset. And then it took

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Speaker 1: a few months for me to fess up like, I’m

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Speaker 1: not actually sure what growth mindset is supposed to mean

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Speaker 1: in terms of my ability to articulate it and apply it.

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Speaker 1: Because it’s not as if when building Rayo’s, We sat

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Speaker 1: around a room and talked about our growth mindset, right?

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Speaker 2: We just did. We just got things done.

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Speaker 1: And that spirit was, I think, inherent in all of

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Speaker 1: us who were attracted to that company, that environment at

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Speaker 1: that time.

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Speaker 2: So it actually took me a bit.

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Speaker 1: To figure out how to articulate this because it really

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Speaker 1: became my number one remit as division president. My primary

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Speaker 1: remit is, Risa, we’re looking to you to drive cultural

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Speaker 1: impact at Campbell’s by perpetuating a growth mindset. So given

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Speaker 1: the importance of it in my remit, I had to

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Speaker 1: figure out what that meant. What it means for me

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Speaker 1: is an obsession with winning in the marketplace. But the

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Speaker 1: how is is really, I would say, around risk-taking. Making

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Speaker 1: fast decisions with limited information is required in a startup

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Speaker 1: environment running an insurgent brand, oftentimes because time and speed

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Speaker 1: are your primary advantage versus big competitors. And secondly, because

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Speaker 1: you just might not have a lot of information. You

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Speaker 1: might not buy Stracona data. You might not be able

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Speaker 1: to afford primary research. And you’re inherently relying on the

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Speaker 1: judgment and experience of your teams. So at a company

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Speaker 1: like Campbell’s, which has a lot of resources and data

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Speaker 1: and information at its fingertips, how do we encourage willingness

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Speaker 1: to fail, less dependency on that data, and inspire people.

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Speaker 2: To be agile?

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Speaker 1: It’s okay to fail. You just have to have a

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Speaker 1: plan to pivot, retool, try something different. So I think culturally,

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Speaker 1: in order to get to that growth mindset, get to

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Speaker 1: that speed, it’s really, I have found conversations about smart

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Speaker 1: risk taking. Now, Risk tolerance cannot be applied as a one-size-fits-all, right?

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Speaker 1: You have to consider the maturity and resiliency of a brand,

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Speaker 1: the health of a category, and also the retailer’s willingness

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Speaker 1: to go along with you, right, on your journey. And

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Speaker 1: they have to be willing to take risks with you.

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Speaker 1: And then, of course, the size and importance of any

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Speaker 1: given brand or business to a company’s P & L.

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Speaker 2: So with the portfolio I run now.

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Speaker 1: with six, seven distinct segments, you cannot take six or

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Speaker 1: seven big risks, right? You have to balance your risk-taking

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Speaker 1: with having safety nets and I’ll call them sure bets.

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Speaker 1: So in a nutshell, I’ve now figured out how to

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Speaker 1: articulate my remit is really around smart risk-taking.

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Speaker 3: So as you think about the smart risk-taking, you talked

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Speaker 3: about the two things that the insurgents have the advantage on,

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Speaker 3: which is time and speed. There is a much bigger organization,

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Speaker 3: more brands, Risk-taking is definitely one element of it, but

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Speaker 3: as you think through, like, what are things that you’ve

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Speaker 3: done to accelerate the time and speed, to get people

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Speaker 3: to get to decisions faster and just pivot when you

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Speaker 3: need to? Or if you have an example you’d be

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Speaker 3: willing to share that says, you know what, we just

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Speaker 3: saw something in the market, and sure, it would have

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Speaker 3: taken us weeks to validate, but, you know… But we

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Speaker 3: have enough pattern recognition to know this is just something

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Speaker 3: we need to go. So an example which we have

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Speaker 3: talked about publicly, it’s an innovation that’s coming out, is

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Speaker 3: around what we’re calling Campbell’s condensed. Sauces, which are launching

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Speaker 3: this summer and will be ubiquitous on shelves this fall

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Speaker 3: going into the holiday season. And this is a product

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Speaker 3: that will have the word sauce on it, on the label,

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Speaker 3: and be merchandised in the soup aisle. That might feel

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Speaker 3: on the surface, like if you’re a tenured Campbell’s employee,

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Speaker 3: if you’ve been a longtime ambassador and steward for the

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Speaker 3: beloved brand, you might say, oh my gosh, that feels

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Speaker 3: terribly risky to have the word sauce on an iconic,

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Speaker 3: you know, Campbell’s dressed package in the soup aisle. When

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Speaker 3: you take a step back, you realize consumers have been

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Speaker 3: using our condensed soups for decades and as cooking sauces,

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Speaker 3: as ingredients incorporating into a broader recipe with a protein

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Speaker 3: and a carbohydrate.

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Speaker 2: So the consumer behavior is there.

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Speaker 1: And we were able to kind of cut through the

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Speaker 1: noise of onerous research, concept testing, et cetera, and just say,

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Speaker 1: we have enough information to based on what consumers are

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Speaker 1: doing with our products today, to have conviction around this,

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Speaker 1: to move quickly, and really jumped right to getting a

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Speaker 1: couple of our top retailers to share that mindset. Once

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Speaker 1: we had that, the conviction within ourselves, the right to

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Speaker 1: win for our brand, the confidence of consumer adoption, and

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Speaker 1: then all kind of validated with retailers nodding their heads,

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Speaker 1: Then you have to ask yourself, what would get us

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Speaker 1: in the way of going quickly? And the answer is

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Speaker 1: probably just our own fear, our own reservations. And then

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Speaker 1: it becomes really like an emotional and psychological conversation with

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Speaker 1: your teams to make them feel safe and reassured in

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Speaker 1: taking that risk.

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Speaker 4: I love that you said that because while you were talking,

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Speaker 4: I was thinking about, and this is an extreme word,

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Speaker 4: but I find… When people are entering periods of change

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Speaker 4: where you’re trying to change the culture, it’s not just

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Speaker 4: the job that they’re within, but it’s their entire career

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Speaker 4: history of PTSD. And you kind of have to like

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Speaker 4: undo all of that, which can be a large responsibility

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Speaker 4: and take a lot of time. So the fact that

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Speaker 4: you hit it on the mental factor of this, I

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Speaker 4: think is so key.

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Speaker 1: And I think to the point you’re making, in a

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Speaker 1: macro environment, Right.

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Speaker 2: Where people are.

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Speaker 1: Struggling with conditions of the world, challenges in their own household.

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Speaker 1: Oftentimes people rely on getting up and going to work

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Speaker 1: every day as being something predictable. And we just don’t

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Speaker 1: have the luxury of minimizing change to enable comfort because

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Speaker 1: status quo is one of the riskiest things that we

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Speaker 1: can do in this environment. So as leaders, this is

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Speaker 1: the most, and I would like to feel I’ve always

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Speaker 1: had intentionality about providing psychological and emotional safety, but I

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Speaker 1: think it’s even more critical as leaders in this environment.

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Speaker 1: If you’re asking people to dig deep, take risks, do

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Speaker 1: maybe scary things in their professional life, you have to

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Speaker 1: be conscious that there might be aspects of their personal

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Speaker 1: life where they’re struggling already with change management or struggling

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Speaker 1: with other circumstances. So I think even just being more

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Speaker 1: in tune and more intentional about providing that emotional safety

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Speaker 1: is very important.

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Speaker 4: So you just talked about the dichotomy of an employee,

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Speaker 4: which is their personal and their professional lives. And as

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Speaker 4: a leader, seeing them as a whole person, taking that example,

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Speaker 4: now bringing it to driving revenue, like driving top line revenue.

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Speaker 4: At the end of the day, you are responsible for

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Speaker 4: business performance. And, you know, Sarah and I have been

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Speaker 4: witness to this, but often the driving sales and building

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Speaker 4: brands that stand the test of time, people feel like

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Speaker 4: those two things are at odds with each other. And

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Speaker 4: so where do you see companies go wrong in thinking

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Speaker 4: about the commercial and the brand building model and how

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Speaker 4: they should function together?

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Speaker 2: Yes.

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Speaker 1: And I will answer that by saying, when I say

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Speaker 1: companies go wrong, I don’t want this to sound like

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Speaker 1: an indictment on other companies and other people. I can

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Speaker 1: articulate this because I’ve gotten it wrong at various points

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Speaker 1: in my career. I do think it comes down to,

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Speaker 1: at times, there’s a lack of shared definition of success

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Speaker 1: at times between traditional brand building metrics and commercial metrics.

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Speaker 1: So what I mean by that, if we think of

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Speaker 1: like a If you were a traditional, you know, academic

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Speaker 1: brand marketer, you’re focused on awareness, equity health scores. These

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Speaker 1: are things that are based on consumer perception, not consumer behavior.

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Speaker 1: So we have to make sure that in addition to

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Speaker 1: bolstering consumer perception of brands, I’m not minimizing the importance

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Speaker 1: of equity health scores. It has to be coupled with

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Speaker 1: contemplation for driving growth. Key commercial metrics. Distribution on shelf.

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Speaker 1: What is your breadth and depth of distribution? Your SKUs,

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Speaker 1: your numbers of stores. Do you have price competitiveness, which

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Speaker 1: is not static. You could have been price competitive last

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Speaker 1: year and not this year, even though you didn’t change anything.

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Speaker 1: The world just changed around you. your merchandising quality, getting

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Speaker 1: more difficult in an environment where retailers are more frugal

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Speaker 1: about how they spend their labor costs, all in service

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Speaker 1: of driving volume-led top-line growth, which ultimately measures consumer behavior,

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Speaker 1: not consumer intention. So bringing those together, consumer perception and

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Speaker 1: intention with consumer behavior. Now, insurgent brands have a bit

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Speaker 1: of an advantage here in that there’s really not a

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Speaker 1: choice to make because your starting point is securing physical availability,

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Speaker 1: driving velocities at shelf through trial generation so that that

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Speaker 1: distribution you’ve worked so hard to get is sustainable and

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Speaker 1: then eventually becomes ubiquitous. And then in time, you focus

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Speaker 1: on those higher order metrics such as repeat, loyalty, mental availability.

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Speaker 2: So I’m And by the way.

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Speaker 1: I just said that applies to insurgent brands, but that

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Speaker 1: can apply also to re-contemplating the path for a mature

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Speaker 1: iconic brand. Is there a point in time where you

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Speaker 1: reset and say, okay, let’s take stock in our distribution footprint,

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Speaker 1: our price competitiveness, even though for decades we may have

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Speaker 1: had anthem campaigns on air to drive equity perception. So

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Speaker 1: It’s important to ensure that brand building initiatives are in

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Speaker 1: service of driving marketplace and financial outcomes. And that in

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Speaker 1: a brand hierarchy of needs, no matter where you are

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Speaker 1: in your life stage, that those key commercial metrics are

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Speaker 1: the foundation of the pyramid.

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Speaker 2: So back to where we started.

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Speaker 1: I think we can get it wrong if we don’t

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Speaker 1: think of traditional brand building and consumer metrics in concert.

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Speaker 3: How do you think about that? Because you talk about

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Speaker 3: the criticality of the, obviously, physical availability, the criticality of

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Speaker 3: brands today in light of the massive pressure from private label.

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Speaker 3: What’s the RQB? Like, what’s the real reason to believe

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Speaker 3: that people should buy brands today in light of so

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Speaker 3: much pressure on consumers’ wallets?

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Speaker 1: I love to ask that question to our key marketers because…

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Speaker 1: If you are responsible for brand, you should be able

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Speaker 1: to answer that question and have a point of view

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Speaker 1: in order to ensure the security of your brand for

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Speaker 1: the long term. So for some context, for your listeners,

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Speaker 1: I do tend to have a lot of conversations about

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Speaker 1: Reyes and building that brand from 80 million to a billion.

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Speaker 1: It’s a compelling story. I love talking about it. But

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Speaker 1: I have had the privilege of leading or being a

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Speaker 1: part of four brands, all four of which are over

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Speaker 1: 100 years old and over a billion dollars, which is Smucker’s,

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Speaker 1: Folgers Coffee, Bird’s Eye Vegetables, and now Campbell’s. And three

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Speaker 1: of them actually have very iconic taglines. You go to

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Speaker 1: a cocktail party, say, I work on Smucker’s, people play

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Speaker 1: back to you the tagline, much like Campbell’s, mm-mm, good.

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Speaker 2: So That’s the context.

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Speaker 1: I have a deep passion for those iconic brands and

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Speaker 1: leading them into the.

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Speaker 2: Next chapter of growth.

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Speaker 1: The responsibility and the burden on those brands to continuously

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Speaker 1: evolve to the changing needs and wants of consumers in

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Speaker 1: order to minimize the need for private brands. So if

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Speaker 1: you’re looking at a category… Where private brands have flourished,

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Speaker 1: I would argue, if we hold up the mirror, it’s

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Speaker 1: probably because traditional brands have failed consumers along the way.

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Speaker 1: And commoditization is an outcome of a brand’s failure to

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Speaker 1: continuously evolve and remain agile and responsive to changing consumer needs.

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Speaker 1: So Bird’s Eye, as an example, was in the category

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Speaker 1: frozen vegetables. The most commoditized category I’ve ever worked on,

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Speaker 1: for all intents and purposes, there’s no trade secrets on

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Speaker 1: broccoli and peas, right? And private label was the largest

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Speaker 1: player in the category. Reinvigorating bird’s eye was not about

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Speaker 1: educating people that vegetables are good for you or about

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Speaker 1: making the perfect floret of broccoli. Reinvigorating bird’s eye was

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Speaker 1: about addressing the number one consumer barrier that competition had not,

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Speaker 1: which is, I don’t like how vegetables taste. And so

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Speaker 1: being able to have a thought leadership position and overcoming

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Speaker 1: that barrier was is not something that private label, with

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Speaker 1: its fragmentation and the role it played in the category,

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Speaker 1: had the ability to do. And that is where we

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Speaker 1: were able to break through and demonstrate to retailers that

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Speaker 1: brands had a role in the category. But I do

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Speaker 1: think to be stewards for the category, we have to

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Speaker 1: give the appropriate and deserved recognition. to the role that

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Speaker 1: private label plays. And if that role is growing at

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Speaker 1: the expense of, you know, we’re diminishing relevance for brands,

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Speaker 1: then that’s our responsibility as brand leaders to fix that.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I think what you’re doing with cooking sauce

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Speaker 3: is just that in and of itself is just changing

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Speaker 3: the face of the aisle in and of itself, staying

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Speaker 3: in the soup aisle, still being a sauce and acknowledging

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Speaker 3: what it is, but acknowledging that only Campbell’s can be

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Speaker 3: bringing it is probably a really good representation of that.

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Speaker 3: When you’re Rao’s and congratulations on it being a billion

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Speaker 3: dollar brand, freaking awesome. But when you are Rao’s and

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Speaker 3: you’ve got so many unique elements to, I’m not giving

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Speaker 3: away the secret recipe, but You know, the sourcing, the

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Speaker 3: whole end-to-end of RAOs, that’s harder to replicate. When you’re

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Speaker 3: in more of a commoditized business, it does change the game.

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Speaker 3: I think your Burzai example is phenomenal.

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Speaker 4: One of your insights, you said, like, essentially, I’m going

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Speaker 4: to boil it down. Brands can get lazy. And they

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Speaker 4: need to take responsibility for… Not Campbell’s brands, baby.

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Speaker 5: No, no.

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Speaker 4: But they need to take responsibility for not innovating. So

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Speaker 4: let’s talk about innovation. Innovation can be really expensive. It

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Speaker 4: could take a whole long time. And the world is

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Speaker 4: changing at a speed that is completely unprecedented. So when

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Speaker 4: you think about product innovation, I love hearing some of

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Speaker 4: your lessons from what you’ve been through. How do you

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Speaker 4: think people today should approach product innovation in such a

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Speaker 4: volatile world with such major stakeholders between brand manufacturer and retailer, consumer,

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Speaker 4: and even in some industries, there could be a third

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Speaker 4: party because of regulation.

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Speaker 1: Three basic principles come to mind in terms of how

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Speaker 1: you approach innovation.

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Speaker 2: First, and this seems so obvious, but I’ve gotten it wrong.

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Speaker 2: I’ve been a part of companies that got it wrong.

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Speaker 1: You have to start with a consumer-led insight. You have

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Speaker 1: to start with fulfilling an unmet need, not what can

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Speaker 1: we make in our plants and how can we convince

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Speaker 1: consumers they need it? Which again, doesn’t sound like a 400.

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Speaker 2: Level class in college.

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Speaker 1: It sounds very basic, but it’s actually a pitfall for

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Speaker 1: many companies and brands. So starting with what is the

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Speaker 1: consumer-led insight? What is the need we are fulfilling that

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Speaker 1: is unmet today? Secondly is right to win.

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Speaker 2: I do think.

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Speaker 1: As an industry and companies I’ve been a part of,

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Speaker 1: we’re pretty good at talking about the brand’s right to win.

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Speaker 1: Often overlooked is, I will call it like the structural

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Speaker 1: right to win, particularly with route to market. You may

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Speaker 1: have a brand that has the right to win in

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Speaker 1: a particular channel, in a particular geography with a certain

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Speaker 1: consumer cohort.

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Speaker 2: You still have to have the mechanisms to get there.

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Speaker 1: That product from point A to point B to drive

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Speaker 1: back to like the point on physical availability, having the

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Speaker 1: right pricing structure, et cetera. So the right to win

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Speaker 1: for the brand, as well as I’ll call it the

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Speaker 1: route to market. And then third, and you mentioned this,

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Speaker 1: that is, uh, sufficient resources to drive awareness and trial, right?

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Speaker 1: Companies are very pressured or P & Ls are pressured.

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Speaker 1: In some cases, certain businesses struggling to have investment sufficiency

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Speaker 1: to protect the core or elevate the core. So then

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Speaker 1: to burden a P & L or a business with

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Speaker 1: also supporting innovation on top of it can be challenging.

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Speaker 1: It’s especially expensive, as we know, to drive innovation if

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Speaker 1: you’re trying to create a new consumer behavior.

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Speaker 2: So resource deficiency is critical.

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Speaker 1: I have, unfortunately, been a part of innovation launches where

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Speaker 1: we had the consumer insight, had the right to win

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Speaker 1: both brand and structurally, but failed to have the right

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Speaker 1: investment to drive consumer awareness and trial. A fourth one,

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Speaker 1: which is less than, I guess you could argue it

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Speaker 1: might be the fourth innovation principle, is innovation. Customer partnership.

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Speaker 1: We still have a gatekeeper who has to nod, nod along.

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Speaker 1: And retailers, we’re asking them for shelf space. Now, certainly

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Speaker 1: the digital shelf has made those barriers of like shelf space.

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Speaker 2: They’ve reduced the barriers a bit.

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Speaker 1: But having retailer support from your top trusted partners is also,

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Speaker 1: in my experience, very, very critical to the ultimate success

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Speaker 1: of an innovation, particularly if you’re doing something very new

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Speaker 1: that requires patience.

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Speaker 2: You have to ask from the outset for patience. You

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Speaker 2: can’t just expect it.

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Speaker 4: I feel the framework you just cited also could be

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00:24:33,600 –> 00:24:35,919
Speaker 4: applied to other categories. Like as you were talking, I

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Speaker 4: was thinking through the lens of software because that’s my

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Speaker 4: business and everything you said is accurate. Well, Risa, we

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Speaker 4: got to ask you our famous last question, which is

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00:24:44,830 –> 00:24:46,290
Speaker 4: what’s the bravest thing you’ve ever done?

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Speaker 1: So a little context for your audience. I am a

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00:24:52,330 –> 00:24:56,790
Speaker 1: Caucasian woman. I do not identify as a member of

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Speaker 1: the LGBTQ community. I grew up in a household with

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00:25:01,800 –> 00:25:03,220
Speaker 1: two English-speaking parents.

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00:25:03,400 –> 00:25:07,919
Speaker 2: We had, I would say, a middle-income lifestyle.

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Speaker 1: I haven’t had the burden of being required to be brave.

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Speaker 1: to get through life because that’s what comes with privilege.

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Speaker 1: The way I describe myself is to ground us in, yes,

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00:25:21,920 –> 00:25:25,659
Speaker 1: I am a woman, but inherently I consider myself a

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00:25:25,720 –> 00:25:29,610
Speaker 1: privileged person and I haven’t encountered anything as a human

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00:25:29,660 –> 00:25:34,230
Speaker 1: walking on earth that required me to have bravery for

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00:25:34,290 –> 00:25:39,649
Speaker 1: survival or even to thrive. So I consider it my

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00:25:39,869 –> 00:25:47,140
Speaker 1: privilege responsibility to be brave. And that’s what comes with privilege.

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00:25:47,200 –> 00:25:49,930
Speaker 1: If you are privileged, you have a responsibility to be brave.

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00:25:50,869 –> 00:25:53,470
Speaker 1: and be a voice for people that don’t have the

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Speaker 1: bandwidth to be brave for others because they’re just trying

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00:25:55,990 –> 00:25:59,929
Speaker 1: to be brave to survive. And it’s hard for me

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Speaker 1: to articulate like a moment or an event that I.

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00:26:04,030 –> 00:26:07,010
Speaker 2: Feel like I could speak to that bravery.

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Speaker 1: But I think of bravery more as like you get

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Speaker 1: up every day, you brush your teeth, you drink your coffee,

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Speaker 1: and you put on your bravery. Like bravery is something

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00:26:14,550 –> 00:26:20,359
Speaker 1: that that you wear. And I approach every day like that.

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Speaker 1: And at this point in my career, it’s a responsibility,

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Speaker 1: but it’s also my purpose, is how to be brave

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Speaker 1: for others, especially when they can’t find that bravery.

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Speaker 2: And it goes a little bit back to where we started.

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Speaker 1: That is how I approach creating psychological and emotional safety

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Speaker 1: for the people around me, peers, sometimes leaders, and certainly

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00:26:47,109 –> 00:26:50,430
Speaker 1: the teams that work with me every day. As someone

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00:26:50,450 –> 00:26:53,109
Speaker 1: who has the privilege to see you in action, I

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00:26:53,609 –> 00:26:56,410
Speaker 1: can certainly say you definitely wear your bravery to work

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00:26:56,470 –> 00:26:58,970
Speaker 1: every day. I think that might be the most thoughtful

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00:26:59,170 –> 00:27:02,379
Speaker 1: answer we have ever had to this question. We’re at

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00:27:02,600 –> 00:27:06,060
Speaker 1: close to 300 episodes and we’ve gotten some great answers,

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00:27:06,200 –> 00:27:08,000
Speaker 1: but I think this might be the most thoughtful one.

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Speaker 2: So thank you. Thank you.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Thank you, Risa. My pleasure. Thank you, ladies.

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Speaker 4: If you like what you heard and you want to

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00:27:16,580 –> 00:27:20,640
Speaker 4: check out more episodes from great leaders at Campbell’s, we’ve

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00:27:20,680 –> 00:27:23,869
Speaker 4: had a few over the years. But in particular, I

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00:27:23,900 –> 00:27:26,950
Speaker 4: suggest you go check out the dual episode we did

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00:27:27,070 –> 00:27:30,389
Speaker 4: with Janda Lukin and Mike Pearson. And don’t forget, tell

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00:27:30,430 –> 00:27:31,490
Speaker 4: a friend, write a review.

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00:27:31,590 –> 00:27:32,270
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening.

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00:27:43,980 –> 00:27:47,940
Speaker 5: Hi, I’m Jackie Cooper, Global Chief Brand Officer at Edelman

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00:27:47,960 –> 00:27:50,720
Speaker 5: and the host of Touch of Truth, a new podcast

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00:27:50,780 –> 00:27:54,220
Speaker 5: launching on the Adweek Podcast Network. My dad gave me

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00:27:54,270 –> 00:27:57,949
Speaker 5: this incredibly smart piece of advice. Meet everyone once. As

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00:27:57,990 –> 00:28:00,310
Speaker 5: a result, I’ve met some of the most fascinating and

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00:28:00,369 –> 00:28:03,490
Speaker 5: inspiring people on the planet. Now on Touch of Truth,

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00:28:03,690 –> 00:28:06,949
Speaker 5: we’re coming center stage and sharing the mic to experience

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00:28:06,990 –> 00:28:09,850
Speaker 5: stories of truth, insights, and visions for the future that

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00:28:09,869 –> 00:28:12,350
Speaker 5: will challenge your way of thinking. Touch of Truth is

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00:28:12,390 –> 00:28:15,930
Speaker 5: available wherever you listen to podcasts. New episodes come out

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00:28:16,119 –> 00:28:18,180
Speaker 5: every Tuesday. I do hope to see you there.