1
00:00:03,650 –> 00:00:05,670
Speaker 1: You as a marketer, and I even say this to

2
00:00:05,710 –> 00:00:08,380
Speaker 1: my own team and to myself, is like, if people

3
00:00:08,740 –> 00:00:13,540
Speaker 1: are making amazing creative ideas themselves on these platforms, on

4
00:00:13,680 –> 00:00:16,360
Speaker 1: our platform, then as a brand, we got to at

5
00:00:16,440 –> 00:00:22,989
Speaker 1: least match or at least lead creativity that inspires as

6
00:00:23,110 –> 00:00:26,360
Speaker 1: much as how they’re creating themselves. So it is almost

7
00:00:26,380 –> 00:00:28,720
Speaker 1: like we have to look outward and continue to see,

8
00:00:28,820 –> 00:00:30,020
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, I can’t believe.

9
00:00:29,900 –> 00:00:32,820
Speaker 2: These people are doing such funny, crazy, amazing things.

10
00:00:33,320 –> 00:00:35,180
Speaker 1: We as a brand at least got to meet them

11
00:00:35,240 –> 00:00:37,920
Speaker 1: where they are or at least contribute again to the

12
00:00:37,960 –> 00:00:39,839
Speaker 1: community that they’re building on these platforms.

13
00:00:41,740 –> 00:00:45,620
Speaker 3: Welcome to today’s episode of Free of Commerce. I’m Sarah Hofstadter.

14
00:00:45,740 –> 00:00:48,450
Speaker 4: And I’m Rachel Tippegraff. And this is a show that

15
00:00:48,510 –> 00:00:51,550
Speaker 4: talks about what’s relevant in commerce for the world’s biggest brands.

16
00:00:51,570 –> 00:00:53,010
Speaker 2: Welcome to Free of Commerce.

17
00:01:00,300 –> 00:01:06,010
Speaker 4: Sarah, with your new business, 37Arc, I’m so curious the

18
00:01:06,290 –> 00:01:11,509
Speaker 4: outputs that CMOs are caring about. In terms of brand

19
00:01:11,530 –> 00:01:15,709
Speaker 4: building and creativity, how is your work laddering up to that?

20
00:01:16,150 –> 00:01:19,449
Speaker 3: It is fascinating because at 37Arc, a lot of what

21
00:01:19,490 –> 00:01:24,039
Speaker 3: we’re doing is around workflow. And so you would think

22
00:01:24,120 –> 00:01:27,140
Speaker 3: workflow may not be sexy, but if you think about

23
00:01:27,819 –> 00:01:30,730
Speaker 3: one of the things that gets in the way of

24
00:01:31,290 –> 00:01:37,140
Speaker 3: work flowing smoothly is relationships. And it’s their internal relationships.

25
00:01:37,280 –> 00:01:38,620
Speaker 3: And like, you don’t want to sit there and turn

26
00:01:38,640 –> 00:01:40,880
Speaker 3: this into like, you know, a therapy session or anything

27
00:01:40,920 –> 00:01:44,480
Speaker 3: like that. But there are so many things that break

28
00:01:44,520 –> 00:01:48,340
Speaker 3: down in decisioning and campaign planning and all that other

29
00:01:48,360 –> 00:01:52,270
Speaker 3: stuff just based on internal relationships and ways of working

30
00:01:52,290 –> 00:01:55,770
Speaker 3: that ends up happening within that. And when you suggest

31
00:01:55,890 –> 00:02:00,090
Speaker 3: that AI can actually play a role in making that

32
00:02:00,250 –> 00:02:04,450
Speaker 3: work better, there’s an initial skepticism, a little bit of hope.

33
00:02:04,790 –> 00:02:06,370
Speaker 3: And then once you show it to them, they’re like,

34
00:02:06,470 –> 00:02:10,750
Speaker 3: oh my God, this is crazy. There are formulas to

35
00:02:10,850 –> 00:02:14,560
Speaker 3: figuring out how to build trust and build relationships and

36
00:02:14,620 –> 00:02:16,760
Speaker 3: things like that, that when you can take a little

37
00:02:16,780 –> 00:02:19,280
Speaker 3: bit of the emotion out of it actually brings it forth.

38
00:02:19,960 –> 00:02:24,360
Speaker 3: It’s been really fascinating. So even some people who were

39
00:02:24,460 –> 00:02:28,720
Speaker 3: initially skeptics on AI And the role that AI plays

40
00:02:28,980 –> 00:02:33,100
Speaker 3: in campaign and brand development and things like that, at

41
00:02:33,120 –> 00:02:36,740
Speaker 3: least from workload process, the skeptics are now converts because

42
00:02:37,560 –> 00:02:40,320
Speaker 3: they see how much gunk is getting out of the system.

43
00:02:41,720 –> 00:02:45,790
Speaker 4: And so where does your work stop and human creativity start?

44
00:02:47,070 –> 00:02:48,950
Speaker 3: Oh, it’s not about getting in the way of human creativity.

45
00:02:48,990 –> 00:02:51,470
Speaker 3: It’s exactly about not getting in the way of the

46
00:02:51,530 –> 00:02:56,160
Speaker 3: human creativity. It’s about creating these spaces where The whole

47
00:02:56,220 –> 00:02:59,390
Speaker 3: brief writing process, just the approval of getting a brief, right?

48
00:02:59,590 –> 00:03:01,350
Speaker 3: Like getting a brief approved. I mean, I remember from

49
00:03:01,389 –> 00:03:05,490
Speaker 3: my agency days, like, oh, well, this one hasn’t approved it. Oh,

50
00:03:05,530 –> 00:03:06,990
Speaker 3: this one wants to make a bit of a change.

51
00:03:07,030 –> 00:03:11,100
Speaker 3: Like just the whole assembly line of brief creation and

52
00:03:11,139 –> 00:03:17,000
Speaker 3: brief approval can be accelerated massively through AI. Just again,

53
00:03:17,020 –> 00:03:21,320
Speaker 3: workflow optimization. When it’s time to actually execute on said

54
00:03:21,400 –> 00:03:24,250
Speaker 3: brief that was created by said strategist and goes to

55
00:03:24,280 –> 00:03:28,100
Speaker 3: the creative teams, beautiful. It’s beautiful because now they’re not

56
00:03:28,280 –> 00:03:31,560
Speaker 3: wasting their time running after people. They’re actually spending their

57
00:03:31,600 –> 00:03:35,020
Speaker 3: time doing the creative work. The more you can get

58
00:03:35,080 –> 00:03:38,080
Speaker 3: people playing in the position that they need to be

59
00:03:38,120 –> 00:03:45,110
Speaker 3: playing in versus being primary wrangler or rodeo lead, the

60
00:03:45,130 –> 00:03:47,450
Speaker 3: more enjoyable your work is going to be. I mean,

61
00:03:47,470 –> 00:03:51,030
Speaker 3: think about just project management in and of itself. That’s

62
00:03:51,050 –> 00:03:54,410
Speaker 3: where I feel like The human step may end up

63
00:03:54,430 –> 00:03:57,820
Speaker 3: taking a step back is that people whose jobs include

64
00:03:57,880 –> 00:04:01,840
Speaker 3: project management can spend more time doing the things that

65
00:04:02,380 –> 00:04:04,700
Speaker 3: they were hired to do outside of project management.

66
00:04:05,180 –> 00:04:07,750
Speaker 4: With all of this work, I have to imagine that

67
00:04:07,790 –> 00:04:11,850
Speaker 4: a big part of what you’re doing is also helping

68
00:04:11,890 –> 00:04:16,969
Speaker 4: organizations clean up their data because none of your workflow

69
00:04:16,990 –> 00:04:19,099
Speaker 4: can work without that structured data.

70
00:04:19,720 –> 00:04:23,920
Speaker 3: Oh, it’s absolutely foundational. The fact that companies are awash

71
00:04:23,940 –> 00:04:26,740
Speaker 3: with data, but they don’t know what they have available

72
00:04:26,779 –> 00:04:29,230
Speaker 3: to them and they don’t know when to use them

73
00:04:29,260 –> 00:04:32,610
Speaker 3: at the right times comes up in almost every diagnostic

74
00:04:33,430 –> 00:04:36,089
Speaker 3: that we’ve done to date. It’s like, oh, well, the

75
00:04:36,130 –> 00:04:38,430
Speaker 3: data sits here or whatever. And they’re like, oh, everybody

76
00:04:38,470 –> 00:04:41,150
Speaker 3: has access to it. No, you have access to a dashboard.

77
00:04:41,210 –> 00:04:44,950
Speaker 3: That’s already been structured data. You want the unstructured data? Oh,

78
00:04:44,980 –> 00:04:47,730
Speaker 3: I’m sorry. You’re going to need like, you know, like

79
00:04:47,870 –> 00:04:52,020
Speaker 3: level seven security clearance kind of stuff. And it’s like, wow,

80
00:04:52,029 –> 00:04:54,200
Speaker 3: you’re paying for all this stuff and you really should

81
00:04:54,220 –> 00:04:58,360
Speaker 3: be able to use it. So democratizing access because you

82
00:04:58,400 –> 00:05:01,870
Speaker 3: can can also help things move a lot faster.

83
00:05:02,070 –> 00:05:04,270
Speaker 4: So our listeners might be thinking, I thought I was

84
00:05:04,330 –> 00:05:07,789
Speaker 4: listening to an episode about Snap and not AI workflows.

85
00:05:08,050 –> 00:05:11,830
Speaker 4: But the reason why I asked Sarah that question is

86
00:05:12,150 –> 00:05:14,320
Speaker 4: we’re going to bring Grace, who’s the CMO of Snap,

87
00:05:14,360 –> 00:05:16,220
Speaker 4: onto the show. And one of the things that she’s

88
00:05:16,240 –> 00:05:19,460
Speaker 4: going to talk about is just the importance of chat

89
00:05:20,320 –> 00:05:24,800
Speaker 4: as an application, especially for advertisers within Snap. And the

90
00:05:24,820 –> 00:05:27,330
Speaker 4: reality is everything that Sarah and I just spoke about

91
00:05:27,740 –> 00:05:31,920
Speaker 4: is all the behind-the-scenes work that even allows a brand

92
00:05:32,440 –> 00:05:35,240
Speaker 4: the possibility to even show up in an environment like that.

93
00:05:36,000 –> 00:05:38,560
Speaker 4: And so we’ll bring Grace onto the show to really

94
00:05:38,580 –> 00:05:41,539
Speaker 4: talk about the output that exists, that in order to

95
00:05:41,560 –> 00:05:45,059
Speaker 4: even get to that output, all of this internal grunt

96
00:05:45,100 –> 00:05:47,900
Speaker 4: work that obviously Sarah is leading the way in helping

97
00:05:48,000 –> 00:05:51,550
Speaker 4: automate is what allows it to happen. So on that note,

98
00:05:51,670 –> 00:05:56,520
Speaker 4: let’s bring Grace onto the show. Today, we are very

99
00:05:56,560 –> 00:06:00,080
Speaker 4: excited to have Grace Cao, the Chief Marketing Officer at Snap,

100
00:06:00,320 –> 00:06:01,969
Speaker 4: onto the show. Hello, Grace.

101
00:06:02,290 –> 00:06:03,130
Speaker 2: Hello, hello.

102
00:06:03,230 –> 00:06:03,970
Speaker 3: Hi, Rachel.

103
00:06:04,070 –> 00:06:04,630
Speaker 5: Hey, Sarah.

104
00:06:04,650 –> 00:06:05,870
Speaker 2: Thank you so much for having me.

105
00:06:06,490 –> 00:06:11,890
Speaker 4: We’re so excited. Looking at your background, you are essentially

106
00:06:12,029 –> 00:06:15,250
Speaker 4: like modern-day tech.

107
00:06:15,810 –> 00:06:16,880
Speaker 1: I’ve been around the apps.

108
00:06:17,180 –> 00:06:23,339
Speaker 4: Yeah, you’ve definitely hit the apps. We got Spotify, Yahoo, Pandora,

109
00:06:23,500 –> 00:06:27,650
Speaker 4: and now Snap. which I can’t imagine many other people

110
00:06:27,710 –> 00:06:30,450
Speaker 4: have a resume similar to yours. So when you look

111
00:06:30,510 –> 00:06:35,110
Speaker 4: back at this moment in time versus probably the last

112
00:06:35,110 –> 00:06:38,350
Speaker 4: 20 years that you’ve been playing in this space, what

113
00:06:38,370 –> 00:06:41,650
Speaker 4: do you feel is different about leading marketing right now?

114
00:06:42,330 –> 00:06:43,089
Speaker 2: Oh my goodness.

115
00:06:43,430 –> 00:06:46,560
Speaker 1: You know, I started my career on the creative agency

116
00:06:46,600 –> 00:06:50,580
Speaker 1: side and so much of it was trying to make amazing,

117
00:06:51,650 –> 00:06:55,230
Speaker 1: great ideas come to life and get people’s attention and

118
00:06:55,310 –> 00:06:57,210
Speaker 1: get them to like consume things.

119
00:06:57,690 –> 00:06:59,630
Speaker 2: And you’re not a big surprise of what I’m about

120
00:06:59,650 –> 00:06:59,890
Speaker 2: to say.

121
00:06:59,910 –> 00:07:02,849
Speaker 1: I think the biggest change, and you’re also speaking to

122
00:07:02,890 –> 00:07:06,210
Speaker 1: a mother of two teenagers, is now that we have

123
00:07:06,250 –> 00:07:10,470
Speaker 1: these tools where consumers or people truly love to express

124
00:07:10,490 –> 00:07:14,390
Speaker 1: themselves and actually engage in a way, not only two-way

125
00:07:14,410 –> 00:07:16,990
Speaker 1: with you and your brand, but with their community. So

126
00:07:17,010 –> 00:07:20,110
Speaker 1: I think the biggest shifts that I’ve seen over the years,

127
00:07:20,190 –> 00:07:23,050
Speaker 1: and probably because of the brands I’ve worked on, is

128
00:07:23,110 –> 00:07:26,430
Speaker 1: how do you create ideas that actually enable the people

129
00:07:26,450 –> 00:07:28,350
Speaker 1: that you’re trying to reach to actually express how they

130
00:07:28,390 –> 00:07:31,500
Speaker 1: feel and connect with you where it is a relationship,

131
00:07:31,540 –> 00:07:34,600
Speaker 1: where it is two-way, where they are contributing, or you’re

132
00:07:34,660 –> 00:07:37,720
Speaker 1: actually contributing to their community. So I think, you know,

133
00:07:37,880 –> 00:07:41,720
Speaker 1: classic from broadcast to, again, oh, you know, more community-driven

134
00:07:41,960 –> 00:07:42,580
Speaker 1: way of marketing.

135
00:07:43,040 –> 00:07:45,440
Speaker 4: You didn’t say AI, so find that interesting.

136
00:07:45,460 –> 00:07:46,020
Speaker 5: Okay.

137
00:07:47,210 –> 00:07:49,860
Speaker 1: Trying, trying to hold.

138
00:07:50,120 –> 00:07:52,020
Speaker 2: I would eventually get to AI.

139
00:07:52,680 –> 00:07:56,000
Speaker 3: Yeah. Let’s talk about that. Let’s unpack that. Is there

140
00:07:56,020 –> 00:07:58,500
Speaker 3: a reason that that didn’t roll off the tongue like

141
00:07:58,540 –> 00:08:01,430
Speaker 3: the others? And if so, why? If not, why not?

142
00:08:01,810 –> 00:08:04,310
Speaker 1: Great question. I’ve been in this industry long enough where

143
00:08:04,390 –> 00:08:06,570
Speaker 1: I’ve seen these big shifts.

144
00:08:06,350 –> 00:08:07,390
Speaker 2: In technology, right?

145
00:08:07,670 –> 00:08:10,450
Speaker 1: I went from like, oh my goodness, get my TV

146
00:08:10,670 –> 00:08:18,450
Speaker 1: ad on the And then now the shift to AI.

147
00:08:18,490 –> 00:08:20,790
Speaker 1: So I think like I think we would eventually talk

148
00:08:20,850 –> 00:08:23,630
Speaker 1: about AI. And quite honestly, it’s hard to not talk

149
00:08:23,670 –> 00:08:26,040
Speaker 1: about it. But to me, you know, the common thread

150
00:08:26,070 –> 00:08:28,940
Speaker 1: that perhaps hasn’t changed is that I think we’re all

151
00:08:29,000 –> 00:08:31,660
Speaker 1: still trying to come up with great ideas to inspire

152
00:08:31,700 –> 00:08:34,720
Speaker 1: and surprise and delight. And AI to me is just

153
00:08:35,140 –> 00:08:39,140
Speaker 1: another revolutionary, amazing piece of technology, the way mobile was

154
00:08:39,220 –> 00:08:42,500
Speaker 1: or digital was that got us to create even more

155
00:08:42,640 –> 00:08:44,540
Speaker 1: different ideas than perhaps that we had before.

156
00:08:45,040 –> 00:08:49,340
Speaker 4: And so on that thread of the focus of creativity

157
00:08:49,540 –> 00:08:54,040
Speaker 4: and breakthrough ideas, we are recording this episode coming off

158
00:08:54,080 –> 00:08:57,550
Speaker 4: of a month of Cannes. And there was a lot

159
00:08:57,570 –> 00:09:00,490
Speaker 4: of discussion around, I’ll call it like human in the

160
00:09:00,550 –> 00:09:04,870
Speaker 4: loop and cultural relevance. I feel that Snap actually for

161
00:09:05,530 –> 00:09:08,370
Speaker 4: the last 15 years has done a really strong job

162
00:09:08,410 –> 00:09:13,439
Speaker 4: of culturally relevant marketing. And when you’re giving advice to

163
00:09:13,500 –> 00:09:17,100
Speaker 4: maybe other CMOs, What’s your take on how to build

164
00:09:17,179 –> 00:09:18,900
Speaker 4: a culturally relevant brand today?

165
00:09:19,380 –> 00:09:21,590
Speaker 2: Oh, my goodness. Well, one, thank you, Rachel, for saying that.

166
00:09:21,610 –> 00:09:23,450
Speaker 2: We try. We try over here at Snap.

167
00:09:24,270 –> 00:09:27,429
Speaker 1: I would say the advice I usually tell people is

168
00:09:27,550 –> 00:09:32,030
Speaker 1: if you look at how people are expressing or creating

169
00:09:32,530 –> 00:09:35,960
Speaker 1: work themselves or ideas on themselves, like you as a marketer,

170
00:09:36,059 –> 00:09:37,660
Speaker 1: and I even say this to my own team and

171
00:09:37,679 –> 00:09:41,460
Speaker 1: to myself, is like if people are making amazing creative

172
00:09:41,480 –> 00:09:46,300
Speaker 1: ideas online, themselves on these platforms, on our platform, then

173
00:09:46,440 –> 00:09:50,000
Speaker 1: as a brand, we got to at least match or

174
00:09:50,179 –> 00:09:55,910
Speaker 1: at least lead creativity that inspires as much as how

175
00:09:55,950 –> 00:09:58,949
Speaker 1: they’re creating themselves. So it is almost like we have

176
00:09:58,990 –> 00:10:01,500
Speaker 1: to look outward and continue to see, oh my gosh,

177
00:10:01,540 –> 00:10:04,260
Speaker 1: I can’t believe these people are doing such funny, crazy,

178
00:10:04,300 –> 00:10:07,120
Speaker 1: amazing things. We as a brand at least got to

179
00:10:07,140 –> 00:10:09,990
Speaker 1: meet them where they are, or at least contribute again

180
00:10:10,030 –> 00:10:12,070
Speaker 1: to the community that they’re building on these platforms.

181
00:10:12,090 –> 00:10:15,350
Speaker 3: That means a lot. And I would echo what Rachel

182
00:10:15,370 –> 00:10:19,810
Speaker 3: said on this cultural relevance aspect. What’s been interesting is

183
00:10:20,050 –> 00:10:22,490
Speaker 3: this broader emphasis on chat. And while I do not

184
00:10:22,530 –> 00:10:25,910
Speaker 3: have teenagers anymore, I’m a decade ahead on that one.

185
00:10:26,690 –> 00:10:31,050
Speaker 3: It’s been fascinating to me to both witness just culturally,

186
00:10:31,090 –> 00:10:34,410
Speaker 3: but also particularly with my nieces and nephews, this emphasis

187
00:10:34,490 –> 00:10:38,080
Speaker 3: on chat. So like what’s been driving that? Cause on

188
00:10:38,100 –> 00:10:40,840
Speaker 3: the one hand, a lot of it started one-to-one, then

189
00:10:40,860 –> 00:10:45,120
Speaker 3: it moved more social. And so snaps has morphed a bit. So,

190
00:10:45,790 –> 00:10:50,210
Speaker 3: How should marketers be thinking about their conversational marketing strategy

191
00:10:50,790 –> 00:10:54,569
Speaker 3: with Snap and just in the context of broader one-to-one communication?

192
00:10:54,809 –> 00:10:55,089
Speaker 4: Yeah.

193
00:10:55,290 –> 00:10:59,990
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, it’s so crazy. I think like 85%

194
00:10:59,990 –> 00:11:03,390
Speaker 1: of people on our platform engage on chat. And I

195
00:11:03,590 –> 00:11:07,770
Speaker 1: think there’s this crazy stat of like 950 billion chats

196
00:11:08,050 –> 00:11:11,370
Speaker 1: were on our platform in just Q1. But Sarah, putting

197
00:11:11,450 –> 00:11:14,750
Speaker 1: young people aside, Sarah, would you not say even your

198
00:11:14,850 –> 00:11:18,840
Speaker 1: everyday Do you not find most of the most interesting

199
00:11:18,900 –> 00:11:22,040
Speaker 1: things that you need to know through your own group chats?

200
00:11:22,120 –> 00:11:25,000
Speaker 1: Like we actually see this group chat behavior, not only

201
00:11:25,059 –> 00:11:28,360
Speaker 1: young people, but even ourselves. I’ve got like, you know,

202
00:11:28,580 –> 00:11:32,230
Speaker 1: my mom group chat going where I find out all

203
00:11:32,270 –> 00:11:36,150
Speaker 1: the inside scoops of like where to vacation, what to buy,

204
00:11:36,250 –> 00:11:38,750
Speaker 1: what’s the sale going on. I mean, it’s just fascinating

205
00:11:38,790 –> 00:11:43,050
Speaker 1: seeing chat behavior in general rise across like all the segments.

206
00:11:43,120 –> 00:11:45,740
Speaker 1: So I don’t know, Sarah, you’ve seen that in your life. too.

207
00:11:46,059 –> 00:11:48,900
Speaker 3: Oh, definitively. I mean, it’s interesting. Is it the evolution

208
00:11:48,940 –> 00:11:51,920
Speaker 3: of the new click, but more inclusive? There’s just a

209
00:11:51,940 –> 00:11:55,000
Speaker 3: definitely a different way of looking at it. And yes,

210
00:11:55,059 –> 00:11:57,790
Speaker 3: most certainly that is the micro community, right?

211
00:11:57,890 –> 00:11:58,210
Speaker 1: Yeah.

212
00:11:58,330 –> 00:12:00,990
Speaker 3: And so being able to figure out where or how

213
00:12:01,110 –> 00:12:05,870
Speaker 3: do brands have a right to play in those kinds

214
00:12:05,910 –> 00:12:09,079
Speaker 3: of groups? Like the last thing I want in any

215
00:12:09,179 –> 00:12:12,140
Speaker 3: of the group chats that I’m in is for somebody

216
00:12:12,160 –> 00:12:14,700
Speaker 3: to be repping a brand. Is there a place for

217
00:12:14,740 –> 00:12:15,700
Speaker 3: that or not so much?

218
00:12:15,720 –> 00:12:16,280
Speaker 5: I don’t know.

219
00:12:16,360 –> 00:12:18,360
Speaker 1: How do you get that delicate balance of like not

220
00:12:18,440 –> 00:12:20,080
Speaker 1: spamming someone, right?

221
00:12:20,240 –> 00:12:21,080
Speaker 2: For sure.

222
00:12:21,200 –> 00:12:23,339
Speaker 3: And getting called out and maybe kicked out of the group.

223
00:12:23,500 –> 00:12:24,120
Speaker 1: Exactly.

224
00:12:24,420 –> 00:12:25,020
Speaker 2: Exactly.

225
00:12:25,120 –> 00:12:25,360
Speaker 5: Right.

226
00:12:25,440 –> 00:12:28,090
Speaker 1: And for years, for years, we actually felt like the

227
00:12:28,160 –> 00:12:31,510
Speaker 1: chat tap was very private and that we should not engage.

228
00:12:31,950 –> 00:12:34,910
Speaker 1: And it was actually through testing, I guess, for any

229
00:12:34,970 –> 00:12:38,990
Speaker 1: piece of marketing, right? If you are true, if you

230
00:12:39,010 –> 00:12:42,620
Speaker 1: really actually bring value to the experience, people do welcome

231
00:12:43,000 –> 00:12:45,780
Speaker 1: that because I think a lot of what we’ve been

232
00:12:45,800 –> 00:12:50,060
Speaker 1: talking already, whether it’s AI or algorithms or this surge

233
00:12:50,080 –> 00:12:54,610
Speaker 1: of automation, I think it’s human nature. We still want

234
00:12:54,730 –> 00:12:58,350
Speaker 1: to have real conversations just like this podcast, or we’re

235
00:12:58,370 –> 00:13:01,450
Speaker 1: going to trust our friends and family first and foremost

236
00:13:01,490 –> 00:13:02,130
Speaker 1: when it comes.

237
00:13:01,970 –> 00:13:04,290
Speaker 2: To advice or guidance. But you’re right, sir.

238
00:13:04,510 –> 00:13:07,370
Speaker 1: It has to be very delicately done and thoughtfully done.

239
00:13:07,900 –> 00:13:09,700
Speaker 1: because when you don’t, and I don’t think this is

240
00:13:09,820 –> 00:13:12,140
Speaker 1: exclusive to chat. I think it’s exclusive to any kind

241
00:13:12,179 –> 00:13:15,000
Speaker 1: of marketing channel that you’re trying to engage in. It’s interesting.

242
00:13:15,059 –> 00:13:17,319
Speaker 4: We get CMOs onto the show all the time and

243
00:13:17,340 –> 00:13:19,080
Speaker 4: I’m racking.

244
00:13:18,740 –> 00:13:19,400
Speaker 2: My brain, Sarah.

245
00:13:19,480 –> 00:13:22,740
Speaker 4: I don’t feel like we’ve had conversational marketing as a topic.

246
00:13:23,340 –> 00:13:26,600
Speaker 4: So what brands do you feel are doing it well

247
00:13:27,000 –> 00:13:29,450
Speaker 4: that others should be paying attention to in that realm?

248
00:13:30,290 –> 00:13:30,689
Speaker 3: Yeah.

249
00:13:31,010 –> 00:13:36,010
Speaker 1: We did this great campaign with Wendy’s and I think

250
00:13:36,620 –> 00:13:39,199
Speaker 1: When you’re engaging in a conversation, the difference between a

251
00:13:39,540 –> 00:13:43,559
Speaker 1: spam or a conversation is you actually are bringing something

252
00:13:43,580 –> 00:13:44,760
Speaker 1: helpful to someone.

253
00:13:44,900 –> 00:13:46,960
Speaker 2: Like, am I giving a piece of information?

254
00:13:46,980 –> 00:13:50,860
Speaker 1: Am I sharing, like, a new deal that we know

255
00:13:50,900 –> 00:13:53,260
Speaker 1: that you love this product and you need to go

256
00:13:53,280 –> 00:13:56,110
Speaker 1: to this place? And so I think we commend and

257
00:13:56,210 –> 00:14:00,710
Speaker 1: love brands like Wendy’s who really embrace the idea like, oh, yeah,

258
00:14:01,010 –> 00:14:03,170
Speaker 1: when we say we want community, we don’t just want

259
00:14:03,190 –> 00:14:03,910
Speaker 1: to broadcast.

260
00:14:03,950 –> 00:14:05,970
Speaker 2: We actually do want to have a two-way conversation.

261
00:14:06,700 –> 00:14:10,040
Speaker 1: So I would say like sponsored snaps is something that

262
00:14:10,220 –> 00:14:13,480
Speaker 1: we launched this past year. I think also being incredibly

263
00:14:13,700 –> 00:14:17,160
Speaker 1: transparent that if something is sponsored or sponsored content is

264
00:14:17,300 –> 00:14:20,440
Speaker 1: also embraced. I think trying to, I think, Sarah, like

265
00:14:20,460 –> 00:14:23,360
Speaker 1: you said, slip it in covertly, thinking not knowing that

266
00:14:23,380 –> 00:14:27,710
Speaker 1: this is somehow sponsored and endorsed obviously gets rejected. But

267
00:14:27,950 –> 00:14:30,510
Speaker 1: when you are transparent, you’re open to it. People are like, oh, yeah,

268
00:14:30,590 –> 00:14:32,970
Speaker 1: thank you for this piece of information. That actually is very,

269
00:14:33,010 –> 00:14:34,910
Speaker 1: very helpful. I’m going to go over to Wendy’s right now.

270
00:14:35,670 –> 00:14:37,070
Speaker 1: So I think that would be one brand that we’ve

271
00:14:37,090 –> 00:14:39,590
Speaker 1: worked with and seen such success on new products like

272
00:14:39,610 –> 00:14:43,810
Speaker 1: small business apps for us. But yeah, conversational commerce, speaking

273
00:14:43,830 –> 00:14:46,620
Speaker 1: of like when we had talked about AI, I think

274
00:14:46,860 –> 00:14:52,560
Speaker 1: AI and prompting also, I would say, accelerated the growth

275
00:14:52,640 –> 00:14:55,340
Speaker 1: of conversational commerce because you can all of a sudden

276
00:14:55,480 –> 00:15:00,290
Speaker 1: have more scaled conversations. And then I often wonder like,

277
00:15:00,390 –> 00:15:01,050
Speaker 1: what’s not going to.

278
00:15:01,010 –> 00:15:01,630
Speaker 2: Be a prompt?

279
00:15:01,750 –> 00:15:04,270
Speaker 1: What’s not going to be a question that you ask?

280
00:15:04,820 –> 00:15:06,480
Speaker 1: So anyway, those are things that we’ve seen.

281
00:15:06,800 –> 00:15:09,520
Speaker 3: Can I pick on that one? Because what are the

282
00:15:09,540 –> 00:15:14,100
Speaker 3: questions you would ask via prompt, which it’s just a question.

283
00:15:14,120 –> 00:15:16,840
Speaker 3: So what are the questions you would ask in a

284
00:15:16,880 –> 00:15:18,620
Speaker 3: prompt versus what are the questions you would ask in

285
00:15:18,640 –> 00:15:19,020
Speaker 3: the chat?

286
00:15:19,200 –> 00:15:19,580
Speaker 5: Yeah.

287
00:15:19,620 –> 00:15:21,560
Speaker 3: Like, do you think that that varies? Do you think

288
00:15:21,600 –> 00:15:26,750
Speaker 3: people have different perspectives on when they’re looking for guidance

289
00:15:26,950 –> 00:15:28,710
Speaker 3: on what to buy? You were talking about a mom’s group.

290
00:15:28,730 –> 00:15:34,350
Speaker 3: So Rachel’s got 11 month old Sid. And she’s trying

291
00:15:34,390 –> 00:15:35,690
Speaker 3: to figure out like what are going to be the

292
00:15:35,730 –> 00:15:37,690
Speaker 3: most educational, like what are going to be the best

293
00:15:37,910 –> 00:15:39,270
Speaker 3: books for her to read to him?

294
00:15:39,340 –> 00:15:39,700
Speaker 2: Yeah.

295
00:15:39,920 –> 00:15:45,060
Speaker 3: Do you think the way conversation happens on Snap is

296
00:15:45,100 –> 00:15:48,880
Speaker 3: going to look different? Just, just the first question. Do

297
00:15:48,920 –> 00:15:52,080
Speaker 3: you think it looks different in a quote unquote human

298
00:15:52,340 –> 00:15:55,350
Speaker 3: interaction versus a AI interaction?

299
00:15:56,210 –> 00:15:57,710
Speaker 2: That’s such a great question, Sarah.

300
00:15:58,260 –> 00:16:00,080
Speaker 1: I don’t know. I don’t know if it’s going to

301
00:16:00,120 –> 00:16:02,840
Speaker 1: be different, to be honest. I think to me, it’s almost,

302
00:16:03,380 –> 00:16:06,260
Speaker 1: you’re going to want different perspectives, right? Sometimes you’re going

303
00:16:06,280 –> 00:16:08,200
Speaker 1: to have the same question, but you would want to

304
00:16:08,240 –> 00:16:11,300
Speaker 1: know directly from the brand what their thought is, right? Oh,

305
00:16:11,450 –> 00:16:14,770
Speaker 1: you know, I would love to know what is the

306
00:16:14,870 –> 00:16:18,250
Speaker 1: best bottle to buy for my baby, you know? And,

307
00:16:18,310 –> 00:16:20,570
Speaker 1: but I still probably want to hear also from the

308
00:16:20,610 –> 00:16:23,670
Speaker 1: friend group as well to get another perspective. So I

309
00:16:23,710 –> 00:16:23,990
Speaker 1: don’t know.

310
00:16:24,050 –> 00:16:26,130
Speaker 2: I don’t think it’s exclusive. I think it’s an ant

311
00:16:26,490 –> 00:16:27,130
Speaker 2: in that situation.

312
00:16:27,380 –> 00:16:27,580
Speaker 1: Yeah.

313
00:16:27,600 –> 00:16:29,740
Speaker 3: I mean, I wonder like even your point on Wendy’s,

314
00:16:29,760 –> 00:16:32,280
Speaker 3: like Wendy’s, those are more impulse purchases, let’s say.

315
00:16:32,420 –> 00:16:33,060
Speaker 2: If you’re hungry.

316
00:16:33,080 –> 00:16:33,500
Speaker 5: Yeah.

317
00:16:34,180 –> 00:16:34,440
Speaker 1: Right.

318
00:16:34,820 –> 00:16:36,160
Speaker 3: If I’m buying a car, it’s going to look a

319
00:16:36,200 –> 00:16:39,500
Speaker 3: lot different than if I’m hungry. But I was working

320
00:16:39,520 –> 00:16:43,850
Speaker 3: on my vacation planning and I was using chat GPT

321
00:16:44,270 –> 00:16:47,990
Speaker 3: for that one. And if it were me, I would

322
00:16:48,010 –> 00:16:50,710
Speaker 3: do blah, blah, blah. I’m like, no, no, no, no, no, no. A,

323
00:16:50,770 –> 00:16:53,030
Speaker 3: you’re not me. And B, you’re not even a human. Like,

324
00:16:53,490 –> 00:16:56,210
Speaker 3: it’s great. you are aggregating information, you are doing all

325
00:16:56,230 –> 00:16:58,070
Speaker 3: the right things, but you just crossed the line. And

326
00:16:58,130 –> 00:16:59,930
Speaker 3: I was like, you just crossed the line, dude. Go

327
00:16:59,970 –> 00:17:01,810
Speaker 3: back to being a robot.

328
00:17:02,130 –> 00:17:04,390
Speaker 2: What was their response?

329
00:17:04,560 –> 00:17:08,639
Speaker 3: Of course, kissing my ass, as it always does. I

330
00:17:08,680 –> 00:17:10,580
Speaker 3: can assure you my friend group does not kiss my

331
00:17:10,680 –> 00:17:14,080
Speaker 3: ass the way chat does. Then they’re going to kick

332
00:17:14,140 –> 00:17:16,530
Speaker 3: my ass and they’re listening now.

333
00:17:16,690 –> 00:17:18,869
Speaker 4: You need to be nice to the LLMs where it

334
00:17:18,910 –> 00:17:26,900
Speaker 4: impacts their answers. So Grace, when brands advertise on Snap,

335
00:17:26,960 –> 00:17:29,180
Speaker 4: do you think they think of Snap as a place

336
00:17:29,240 –> 00:17:31,619
Speaker 4: to build brand awareness or drive sales?

337
00:17:32,300 –> 00:17:33,160
Speaker 2: We would hope for both.

338
00:17:33,680 –> 00:17:36,940
Speaker 1: I think one of the misconceptions about Snapchat, in my opinion,

339
00:17:37,340 –> 00:17:39,700
Speaker 1: would be that we, you know, of course I’m.

340
00:17:39,600 –> 00:17:42,119
Speaker 2: Biased, but I think, you know, we are a super app.

341
00:17:42,140 –> 00:17:45,359
Speaker 2: We’re actually five apps in one. Like we have camera,

342
00:17:45,600 –> 00:17:47,560
Speaker 2: we have map. I don’t know if you know this,

343
00:17:47,600 –> 00:17:48,020
Speaker 2: but we’re.

344
00:17:47,940 –> 00:17:52,290
Speaker 1: Like the second most used map. where brands can show

345
00:17:52,350 –> 00:17:55,270
Speaker 1: up on the map and talking about impulses or finding,

346
00:17:55,310 –> 00:17:59,010
Speaker 1: you know, a place where you can seamlessly integrate and

347
00:17:59,150 –> 00:18:01,929
Speaker 1: actually provide value of like, oh my goodness, why don’t

348
00:18:01,950 –> 00:18:03,650
Speaker 1: we all meet up at this one place, you know,

349
00:18:03,810 –> 00:18:06,590
Speaker 1: because we’re all around here. You know, we obviously have chat,

350
00:18:06,950 –> 00:18:10,429
Speaker 1: we have stories, we have spotlight for our video. So

351
00:18:10,470 –> 00:18:13,030
Speaker 1: I think one of the misconceptions I think people think

352
00:18:13,050 –> 00:18:16,570
Speaker 1: about Snapchat is that it’s one dimensional when you actually

353
00:18:16,590 –> 00:18:20,800
Speaker 1: have these five surfaces That can drive brand awareness, but

354
00:18:20,890 –> 00:18:23,580
Speaker 1: also really drive performance and lower conversion too.

355
00:18:23,640 –> 00:18:26,760
Speaker 2: So I think people forget that we have all these other.

356
00:18:26,460 –> 00:18:31,850
Speaker 1: Tabs that you could really, I would say, provide value.

357
00:18:32,190 –> 00:18:35,770
Speaker 1: We’re a utility app, to be honest, versus perhaps some

358
00:18:35,810 –> 00:18:38,190
Speaker 1: other platforms are more entertainment focused.

359
00:18:38,270 –> 00:18:40,570
Speaker 2: I like to say we’re utilitarian.

360
00:18:41,580 –> 00:18:42,780
Speaker 3: That’s so interesting.

361
00:18:43,609 –> 00:18:47,600
Speaker 4: As there’s increasing pressure for advertisers on like where to

362
00:18:47,640 –> 00:18:52,459
Speaker 4: invest their next dollar, especially with measurement, how do you

363
00:18:52,480 –> 00:18:54,979
Speaker 4: think about snaps positioning in that ecosystem?

364
00:18:55,660 –> 00:18:58,260
Speaker 1: Measurement is also key, right? Every, you know, I know

365
00:18:58,280 –> 00:19:02,480
Speaker 1: I have to answer to my CFO every single day.

366
00:19:02,500 –> 00:19:06,159
Speaker 1: I think what keeps me up at night is that

367
00:19:06,700 –> 00:19:10,450
Speaker 1: there are behaviors that are happening with people today. And

368
00:19:10,590 –> 00:19:14,220
Speaker 1: of course, you’re going to have your scaled behavior. channels

369
00:19:14,600 –> 00:19:19,100
Speaker 1: for sure. But when you do look at things like conversation,

370
00:19:19,180 –> 00:19:25,000
Speaker 1: when you look at maps, when you look at AR, AI,

371
00:19:25,140 –> 00:19:28,550
Speaker 1: like there’s all these new technologies that people are using

372
00:19:28,609 –> 00:19:32,909
Speaker 1: in their every day that have such creative potential. I

373
00:19:32,950 –> 00:19:36,450
Speaker 1: think it’s like, how do you reconcile the measurement of that, right?

374
00:19:36,490 –> 00:19:41,200
Speaker 1: The measurement of adopting new innovative ways that your brand

375
00:19:41,220 –> 00:19:43,220
Speaker 1: can show up and how can that also be a

376
00:19:43,320 –> 00:19:45,950
Speaker 1: priority as you do your planning is something that I

377
00:19:45,970 –> 00:19:48,590
Speaker 1: think when I talk to my peers, we.

378
00:19:48,530 –> 00:19:49,210
Speaker 2: Often talk about.

379
00:19:49,450 –> 00:19:52,170
Speaker 1: We’re on one hand pushed for ROI, but we’re also.

380
00:19:51,970 –> 00:19:55,260
Speaker 2: Being pushed to innovate as well. Snapchat can play a

381
00:19:55,300 –> 00:19:56,580
Speaker 2: role in both of those.

382
00:19:56,900 –> 00:19:57,140
Speaker 3: Yeah.

383
00:19:57,200 –> 00:19:59,520
Speaker 4: You definitely have your own set of conversations that are

384
00:19:59,560 –> 00:20:01,379
Speaker 4: very similar to the folks we get on who are

385
00:20:01,400 –> 00:20:04,500
Speaker 4: on the advertising side in terms of managing the expectations

386
00:20:04,520 –> 00:20:04,960
Speaker 4: with the CFO.

387
00:20:04,980 –> 00:20:06,220
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah.

388
00:20:07,119 –> 00:20:09,840
Speaker 4: Well, Grace, we have to ask you our famous last question,

389
00:20:09,960 –> 00:20:12,020
Speaker 4: which is what’s the bravest thing you’ve ever done?

390
00:20:12,040 –> 00:20:14,340
Speaker 2: Oh, my goodness.

391
00:20:14,380 –> 00:20:16,500
Speaker 1: When I saw this question, I really was like, oh,

392
00:20:16,540 –> 00:20:19,780
Speaker 1: what can I think that would be provocative?

393
00:20:19,880 –> 00:20:22,560
Speaker 2: And I would say showing up every day in a.

394
00:20:23,060 –> 00:20:25,760
Speaker 1: Sense of, you know, I do think that the industry

395
00:20:25,880 –> 00:20:28,700
Speaker 1: from a representation standpoint has gotten better.

396
00:20:29,220 –> 00:20:30,010
Speaker 2: But I don’t know.

397
00:20:30,030 –> 00:20:32,890
Speaker 1: I still think I go into rooms and I’m like

398
00:20:32,930 –> 00:20:36,530
Speaker 1: the only person that looks like myself and coming in with.

399
00:20:36,990 –> 00:20:41,210
Speaker 1: maybe some ideas or perspective that’s different from everybody else.

400
00:20:41,290 –> 00:20:43,450
Speaker 1: And I think everybody probably has felt that way some

401
00:20:43,530 –> 00:20:46,530
Speaker 1: point in their careers or in their journey. So yeah,

402
00:20:46,710 –> 00:20:49,310
Speaker 1: I don’t know. I hope this answer isn’t too plain,

403
00:20:49,390 –> 00:20:53,080
Speaker 1: but I don’t know, still like showing up, trying to

404
00:20:53,630 –> 00:20:55,430
Speaker 1: bring a perspective that nobody else has.

405
00:20:55,619 –> 00:20:57,379
Speaker 2: I still think that’s a brave thing for all of

406
00:20:57,460 –> 00:20:58,900
Speaker 2: us in this industry.

407
00:20:59,320 –> 00:21:02,359
Speaker 1: And yeah, I would say thank you so much in

408
00:21:02,400 –> 00:21:05,300
Speaker 1: this podcast alone for giving me the opportunity.

409
00:21:04,760 –> 00:21:08,390
Speaker 4: To Love how human that answer is. And I’m sure

410
00:21:08,490 –> 00:21:12,369
Speaker 4: many of our listeners can relate. If you like what

411
00:21:12,390 –> 00:21:14,480
Speaker 4: you heard and you want to keep thinking about how

412
00:21:14,540 –> 00:21:19,020
Speaker 4: CMOs are leading the way to build brand growth via culture,

413
00:21:19,100 –> 00:21:21,500
Speaker 4: go check out a recent episode we did with Nick Tran.

414
00:21:21,960 –> 00:21:23,760
Speaker 4: And if you like what you heard, write a review.

415
00:21:23,880 –> 00:21:24,700
Speaker 4: Thanks for listening.

416
00:21:34,630 –> 00:21:35,690
Speaker 3: Thank you.

417
00:21:47,340 –> 00:21:51,300
Speaker 5: Hi, I’m Jackie Cooper, Global Chief Brand Officer at Edelman

418
00:21:51,340 –> 00:21:54,100
Speaker 5: and the host of Touch of Truth, a new podcast

419
00:21:54,160 –> 00:21:57,609
Speaker 5: launching on the Adweek Podcast Network. My dad gave me

420
00:21:57,640 –> 00:22:01,330
Speaker 5: this incredibly smart piece of advice. Meet everyone once. As

421
00:22:01,369 –> 00:22:03,669
Speaker 5: a result, I’ve met some of the most fascinating and

422
00:22:03,750 –> 00:22:06,850
Speaker 5: inspiring people on the planet. Now on Touch of Truth,

423
00:22:07,070 –> 00:22:10,330
Speaker 5: we’re coming centre stage and sharing the mic to experience

424
00:22:10,369 –> 00:22:13,240
Speaker 5: stories of truth, insights and visions for the future that

425
00:22:13,260 –> 00:22:15,720
Speaker 5: will challenge your way of thinking. Touch of Truth is

426
00:22:15,780 –> 00:22:19,300
Speaker 5: available wherever you listen to podcasts. New episodes come out

427
00:22:19,500 –> 00:22:21,570
Speaker 5: every Tuesday. I do hope to see you there.