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Speaker 1: So much of our job is communications. It’s not rocket science.

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Speaker 2: We make sure that everyone understands what we’re doing, what

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Speaker 2: good looks like, and we measure if that’s actually happening.

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Speaker 2: And the more people speak the same language, track the

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Speaker 2: same things, it’s a scalable concept. So then the actual change,

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Speaker 2: the how, right? That is the rocket science. How to

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Speaker 2: have a company which is very old, century old, change

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Speaker 2: their behaviors.

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Speaker 1: Not just a.

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Speaker 2: Marketing, sales thing, but supply, finance, data, everything has to change.

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Speaker 2: This sounds like I read it in a textbook, but

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Speaker 2: this is basically through trial and error.

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Speaker 1: I’ve kind of learned this in the last decade.

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Speaker 2: It’s kind of the four steps for me that I

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Speaker 2: first unconsciously, but now consciously applied.

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Speaker 3: Welcome to today’s episode of Brave Commerce. I’m Rachel Tippegraff,

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Speaker 3: the founder and CEO of Micmac.

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Speaker 4: I’m Sarah Hofstetter, president of Profitero.

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Speaker 3: And this is a show that talks about what’s relevant

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Speaker 3: in e-commerce for the world’s biggest brands. Welcome to Brave Commerce.

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Speaker 4: Rachel, you have been on a tear of late.

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Speaker 5: Every time I turn around, there’s another press release, whether

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Speaker 5: it’s a new innovation or it’s a new acquisition.

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Speaker 4: You guys are on fire. I can’t even keep track

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Speaker 4: of everything you guys are doing. It’s a lot.

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Speaker 6: Absolutely.

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Speaker 3: This past calendar year of 2023 was probably will go

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Speaker 3: down as the most pivotal year in.

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Speaker 5: The entire business and you’ve done it through a combination

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Speaker 5: of organic and inorganic part of it has been through

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Speaker 5: acquisition so as you have thought through the acquisitions that

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Speaker 5: you have done how do you get the acquired organization

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Speaker 5: to feel like they’re a part of it that they

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Speaker 5: understand and that they have belief in the new leadership

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Speaker 5: team or the expanded leadership team when it happens Yeah.

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Speaker 3: I mean, it’s very hard. I don’t think anyone ever

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Speaker 3: says change management is easy. And for anyone who’s ever

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Speaker 3: done M & A, the saying that the real work

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Speaker 3: starts after you close the deal is absolutely true. I

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Speaker 3: think the big thing, so we made two acquisitions last year.

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Speaker 3: One was a company based in Paris called Suaven and

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Speaker 3: the other was a global business channel advisor in which

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Speaker 3: we did a carve out from Commerce Hub. And we

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Speaker 3: picked up employees who were based in the US, the

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Speaker 3: UK and Ireland, France, and Spain. And so what I

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Speaker 3: can tell you with the year behind us is the

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Speaker 3: most important thing initially is for the collective employee base

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Speaker 3: to understand the why, like really understand the acquisition thesis

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Speaker 3: and create a space for them to ask questions because

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Speaker 3: you want to ensure that nothing is unclear from there.

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Speaker 3: I think the second thing is making it clear that

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Speaker 3: things are going to change. Like not pretending everything is

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Speaker 3: going to continue as is. And the reality is you

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Speaker 3: have distinct companies, unique cultures and cultural differences all coming together.

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Speaker 3: And you’re defining a new way forward. And then it’s

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Speaker 3: constant check it points up and down the totem pole

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Speaker 3: to make sure that people are committed to the change.

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Speaker 3: I might be too binary in some ways, but the

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Speaker 3: way that I think about it is either on the

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Speaker 3: boat or you’re off the boat. And if you’re off

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Speaker 3: the boat, that’s totally okay. But you want to get

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Speaker 3: off the boat then pretty quickly. Because there’s a bunch

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Speaker 3: of people who are on the boat who we need

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Speaker 3: rowing in the same direction. And so that’s essentially been

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Speaker 3: my journey over the last year.

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Speaker 4: Interesting.

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Speaker 5: There’s so many parallels to the stuff that you’ve been

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Speaker 5: doing and the stuff that so many of our guests

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Speaker 5: have to go through. These global leaders of e-commerce who

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Speaker 5: have to bring people along. And in some cases, it’s

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Speaker 5: kicking and screaming. In other cases, it’s with arms wide open.

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Speaker 5: But I think clarifying, here’s what we’re looking to achieve here. And,

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Speaker 5: you know, you’re on the boat, you’re off the boat,

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Speaker 5: but also giving them reasons to believe. One of the

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Speaker 5: things that Buss Van Kesteren has been so successful at

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Speaker 5: doing at Sanofi over the past couple of years is

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Speaker 5: defining what it means to be on the boat, showing

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Speaker 5: signs of success of what that means, admitting areas that

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Speaker 5: didn’t work as well, and then taking things that have

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Speaker 5: worked well and optimize the crap out of them. And

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Speaker 5: the things that, and I think that’s such a good

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Speaker 5: sign of a good leader of setting the goal, proving

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Speaker 5: it out, admitting mistakes, optimizing, making sure that the goalposts

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Speaker 5: continue to move, but to communicate as we get that through.

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Speaker 3: Absolutely. Well, on that note, let’s bring Buss onto the show.

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Speaker 5: We are honored to have Buss von Kusseren here. the

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Speaker 5: global head of e-commerce at Sanofi. Did I get all

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Speaker 5: of those pronunciations right? Because that’s a lot.

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Speaker 1: That was 99% perfect. You’re almost a Dutch questioner.

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Speaker 4: I think I said Van Kesteren, but it’s really Van Kesteren, correct?

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Speaker 1: Van Kesteren, but I can work with Van Kesteren. It’s okay.

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Speaker 4: Okay, that’s pretty good.

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Speaker 5: You know, as somebody with such a simple name like Sarah,

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Speaker 5: I don’t appreciate the complexity of all of the pronunciations.

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Speaker 4: So thank you very.

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Speaker 1: Much for that.

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Speaker 5: You would think that we’d have just for the first time,

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Speaker 5: except me and you must go back.

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Speaker 4: We go back.

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Speaker 5: This is an old school conversation just being brought to

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Speaker 5: you live. So, first of all, thank you so much

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Speaker 5: for joining us. It’s been hard to pin you down

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Speaker 5: with all of your global travels. So thanks for.

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Speaker 4: Finding the time for us.

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Speaker 1: Thanks for having me.

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Speaker 5: So I wanted to kind of just kind of get

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Speaker 5: into it. The different areas we really would love to

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Speaker 5: dive into with you are, A, the complexities of what

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Speaker 5: it means to to deal with leading a global team

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Speaker 5: and leading with a combination of control and influence. Also

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Speaker 5: want to talk a little bit about the unique elements

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Speaker 5: specifically around the healthcare and OTC kind of a world

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Speaker 5: and pharma.

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Speaker 4: There’s a lot of.

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Speaker 5: Complexity when you start kind of diving a little bit

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Speaker 5: deeper into that by country and how you can convince

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Speaker 5: each market why e-commerce is important to them. And even

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Speaker 5: if the one-to-one kind of different areas of dollar in,

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Speaker 5: dollar out may not be as easy to track, what

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Speaker 5: really goes into it?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, let’s go on.

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Speaker 5: Cool. Yep. All right.

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Speaker 4: You are cool.

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Speaker 5: Let’s first start talking about the Sudoku company in and

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Speaker 5: of itself. Because one of the big areas that we’ve

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Speaker 5: seen in the press is promoting awareness of gut health,

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Speaker 5: digestive wellness. And you guys have some brands that fit

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Speaker 5: the bill on there. That’s a hot topic, hot trend.

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Speaker 5: How do you think about that through the lens, capitalizing

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Speaker 5: on that, particularly from a commerce lens?

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Speaker 2: It’s a great question. This is one of the main

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Speaker 2: reasons I joined this company, right? So because we’re trying

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Speaker 2: to really solve consumer needs, consumer needs that I find

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Speaker 2: very important, where we’re really solving health problems. And coming

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Speaker 2: from beer and coming from dishwasher tablets, this feels like

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Speaker 2: a bigger thing. And in this world where we’re switching

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Speaker 2: things to over-the-counter medicine like gut health, but also allergy

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Speaker 2: and pain, et cetera. It feels like we can do

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Speaker 2: a lot for this category, really help people with real problems.

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Speaker 2: So to your point, this conversation about gut health is

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Speaker 2: becoming bigger and bigger and more relevant to more people.

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Speaker 2: The cool thing about e-commerce is we can be more

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Speaker 2: than just a sales channel. We can be more than

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Speaker 2: just another option for people to buy their products. We

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Speaker 2: can make this way more convenient. We can explain it

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Speaker 2: better to people. And I think one of the cool

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Speaker 2: things is also happening. We can like better react to people, right?

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Speaker 2: There’s an increased amount of conversations. We structurally measure this.

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Speaker 2: We have tools, all the tools that my colleagues at

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Speaker 2: other companies have, but we can really see the increase

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Speaker 2: in conversation, the relevant terms, and we can react to

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Speaker 2: that with proper solutions. And via conversion, we can not

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Speaker 2: just see that we’re doing well from a capitalist point

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Speaker 2: of view, but also that we’re really solving this problem

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Speaker 2: and people come back to it.

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Speaker 1: That’s what excites me. Not just gut health, but all

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Speaker 1: these categories.

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Speaker 3: So you have, it seems, market tailwinds playing in the

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Speaker 3: favor of the Sanofi portfolio. Maybe not all categories are

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Speaker 3: made equal, but there is this major market tailwind. One

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Speaker 3: of the ways that you could probably capitalize on this

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Speaker 3: tailwind is ensuring that you have the right organizational structure.

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Speaker 3: Because it also could get in the way. People can’t

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Speaker 3: figure out how to work together. And you have such

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Speaker 3: an interesting dynamic that happens at Santa Fe because the

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Speaker 3: global headquarters is in France, yet so much of the

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Speaker 3: revenue performance sits in geographies like North America and Asia.

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Speaker 3: And your team is all over the world. So how

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Speaker 3: do you design an org structure, rules of engagement, a

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Speaker 3: culture that allows people to work globally and locally to

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Speaker 3: capitalize on these market tailwinds?

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Speaker 2: So the first thing is, indeed, most money we make

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Speaker 2: is not in Europe where we are based. It’s very

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Speaker 2: much in the Americas and Asia, especially China, South Korea, Japan,

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Speaker 2: and the other side, Brazil, Mexico, US. So you were right.

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Speaker 2: So how do you organize for that? There’s multiple things there.

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Speaker 2: First of all, I think you have to turn this

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Speaker 2: org chart’s reliance, if that’s a word, right? People tend

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Speaker 2: to look at org charts to make up what they

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Speaker 2: have to do, what they have to listen to. You

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Speaker 2: have to turn it from that… into giving people clear

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Speaker 2: direction and a mission and things to measure on, where

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Speaker 2: the org charts become less important and the results become

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Speaker 2: really important. And that’s what I try to drive. So

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Speaker 2: wherever people are, whatever their roles are, I try to

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Speaker 2: make sure there’s clear direction and clear objectives that they

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Speaker 2: all meet. And we make sure we measure it. After that,

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Speaker 2: of course, we do set clear direction on a sub-level, right?

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Speaker 2: We kind of know what are the things in e-commerce

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Speaker 2: that will drive the business most, which is the most

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Speaker 2: important things to do. So we give that structure, we

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Speaker 2: measure it, we get the right tools. We work together

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Speaker 2: with the right partners. But the org charts, because of

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Speaker 2: this direction and because of this structure, become less and

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Speaker 2: less important. It’s just making sure that the right people

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Speaker 2: at the right direction sit in the right places. And

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Speaker 2: then in my case, it’s still flying around a lot.

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Speaker 1: Sorry, universe.

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Speaker 2: I’ll try to compensate for it and still try to

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Speaker 2: make sure that everyone is in that direction.

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Speaker 1: Did I answer your question there? Absolutely.

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Speaker 3: As someone who is running a multinational company, I’m curious

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Speaker 3: your perspective on time zones and overlapping work hours. I

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Speaker 3: recently was in Paris with the Micmac team and there

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Speaker 3: was only three really core working hours where it overlapped

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Speaker 3: with the North America business. And I’m just curious how

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Speaker 3: you tackle that.

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Speaker 2: So this is something, No one of us have solved.

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Speaker 2: We are almost permanently jet lagged, but you get better

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Speaker 2: at that, right? Also, you have to find these overlapping moments.

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Speaker 2: So we also have big business in Australia. So you

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Speaker 2: kind of have to kind of make sure you cover

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Speaker 2: the world all the way from Sydney and Brisbane all

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Speaker 2: the way to Sao Paulo and Mexico City. So you

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Speaker 2: find these overlapping moments, but also you just adjust and

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Speaker 2: you make sure you kind of peak in the right moments.

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Speaker 1: And again, it’s back to communications, giving clear direction.

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Speaker 2: So you make sure that people know what to do,

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Speaker 2: where to do it, even if you’re not there to

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Speaker 2: micromanage them. And I think that’s also the type of

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Speaker 2: people we hire, people that can handle this. They have

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Speaker 2: direction and that you can kind of leave them alone,

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Speaker 2: have them work autonomously. And then come into these overlapping

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Speaker 2: moments to check if it’s actually happening, right? And basically

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Speaker 2: take out the extremes. From a lifestyle perspective, it’s not

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Speaker 2: the easiest lifestyle. We do have some product that we sell,

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Speaker 2: like Unisom, to help. One, it’s something you get used to,

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Speaker 2: you get better and better at over the years, right?

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Speaker 2: But it’s never easy. You never get truly.

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Speaker 1: Used to it.

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Speaker 5: I feel like I live my life balancing Unisom and coffee.

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Speaker 4: Probably not the best combo, but you know what? It

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Speaker 4: does the trick, so.

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Speaker 5: You know, you and I have had the opportunity to

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Speaker 5: work together on a number of initiatives, specifically around influencing

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Speaker 5: at a global level, particularly, obviously, as it relates to

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Speaker 5: digital shelf and trying to create some sort of a

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Speaker 5: common language, despite all of the different cultural differences. One

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Speaker 5: of the things that word on the street is about

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Speaker 5: you from your team is how good you are at

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Speaker 5: establishing relationships.

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Speaker 4: A level of common language in terms of what is.

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Speaker 5: Within your ability to control when and where to ask

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Speaker 5: for help. Are there any tips that you can share

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Speaker 5: for others that are in a similar position to you

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Speaker 5: that have to figure out how to speak different maybe

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Speaker 5: dialects of the same language, but still create a commonality

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Speaker 5: around e-comm? And to that end, anybody who’s learning to

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Speaker 5: influence at a more global level, for things that are

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Speaker 5: evolving at a faster speed than perhaps the rest of

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Speaker 5: the organization.

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Speaker 4: How do you go about doing that?

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Speaker 2: So luckily, this is a podcast, so you can see

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Speaker 2: me blushing, right? But thank you, and I’ll try to

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Speaker 2: live up to it. So there’s two parts to this, right?

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Speaker 2: First of all, you already said it, and what we’ve

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Speaker 2: been working with you on, Sarah, this language piece, right?

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Speaker 1: So much of our job is communications. It’s not rocket science.

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Speaker 2: We make sure that everyone understands what we’re doing, what

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Speaker 2: good looks like, and we measure if that’s actually happening.

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Speaker 2: And the more people speak the same language, track the

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Speaker 2: same things, scalable concept. So then the actual change, the how, right?

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Speaker 2: That is the rocket science. How to have a company

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Speaker 2: which is very old, century old, change their behaviors. Not

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Speaker 2: just a marketing theory or sales thing, but supply, finance, data,

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Speaker 2: everything has to change. This sounds like I read it

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Speaker 2: in a textbook, but this is basically through trial and error.

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Speaker 1: I’ve kind of learned this in the last decade.

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Speaker 2: It’s kind of the four steps for me that I

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Speaker 2: first unconsciously, but now consciously applied. When I go into

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Speaker 2: a new role in a company, Step one is still,

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Speaker 2: there’s a theoretical part. I build a strategy and you know,

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Speaker 2: I work in spreadsheets. I get an idea of like,

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Speaker 2: what’s the best thing I can solve or what I

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Speaker 2: can do. So I have a clear way to go.

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Speaker 2: But then step two is the key point. I think

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Speaker 2: the one that most people get wrong and where people

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Speaker 2: have the most hard time. I actually try to force

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Speaker 2: two or three places where I actually did it.

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Speaker 1: I turn things into action.

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Speaker 2: And sometimes that may seem very red and very dominant,

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Speaker 2: but But I just know that if I don’t just

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Speaker 2: put it on PowerPoint or just talk about it, but

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Speaker 2: I can actually tell them, hey, I actually did this

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Speaker 2: thing in the US or did this thing in Mexico.

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Speaker 1: You can actually see this.

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Speaker 5: It works.

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Speaker 2: Now there’s an ROI and there’s net sales coming from it.

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Speaker 2: That makes all the other steps so much easier. Because

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Speaker 2: step three is taking that thing that worked and also

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Speaker 2: some things that didn’t work by the way, but taking

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Speaker 2: the things that worked and scaling it across. That’s where

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Speaker 2: you go into sales mode. You say, hey, This is

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Speaker 2: what I did. This is why I did it. I’ve

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Speaker 2: proven it to you. Now we have to make it

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Speaker 2: work for you. And the rest of it’s just step four,

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Speaker 2: which is kind of keeping on doing that and adding

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Speaker 2: more things, making more decisions, but always starting with actually

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Speaker 2: doing it and then going back in those steps, right?

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Speaker 1: I think that’s the clear thing. It’s not just language.

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Speaker 2: It’s actually walking the talk and really making sure in

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Speaker 2: the beginning of a new role, a new job in

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Speaker 2: a new company, you find the quickest path to actually

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Speaker 2: launching something end-to-end and actually having something in your hands,

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Speaker 2: which is tangible and works. That’s always helped me a lot.

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Speaker 2: And that’s what I sometimes miss a lot with other people,

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Speaker 2: other companies. They’re very good at the other things that

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Speaker 2: I’m not good at, but I think that’s the main

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Speaker 2: thing that’s working well for me.

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Speaker 4: I do love the four-step process.

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Speaker 5: I think it speaks to actually a lot of business

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Speaker 5: books about that, but I like how you’re putting some

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Speaker 5: more tangible stuff behind it, particularly on step two, when

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Speaker 5: you pick What are the two to three wins you’re

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Speaker 5: going to be putting on the board and then balancing

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Speaker 5: them in step three with some wins, some learning, things

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Speaker 5: like that. So obviously if it were easy, anyone would

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Speaker 5: do it. So it’s supposed to be hard. If you

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Speaker 5: make it look super easy, then somebody might not necessarily

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Speaker 5: be necessary. That all being said, as you get to

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Speaker 5: identify those wins on the board, you’ve got to come

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Speaker 5: up with, I don’t know, memory stickers, something that becomes

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Speaker 5: almost like your flagship. Is there an example that you

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Speaker 5: feel comfortable sharing with us about that?

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Speaker 2: I want to share as much as I can, right,

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Speaker 2: for the audience, but I have to be a bit

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Speaker 2: careful with certain things.

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Speaker 1: Of course.

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Speaker 2: Before I was doing these kind of jobs for these

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Speaker 2: kind of big companies, I was in consulting for a while.

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Speaker 2: So I had like the standard strategy consulting background and

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Speaker 2: I still do apply it, right? So when I start,

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Speaker 2: there’s a clear framework. There’s, in my case, eight pillars

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Speaker 2: of growth. I kind of know what the to-be looks

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Speaker 2: like per country, per brand, and I do track versus that.

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Speaker 2: That goes back to the language point. So I make

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Speaker 2: sure before I begin, before I put it into action,

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Speaker 2: people kind of know what I’m doing. It’s just that

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Speaker 2: just knowing what I’m doing and just communicating is not enough.

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Speaker 2: It’s only the moment where you’ve actually done it and

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Speaker 2: you’ve basically by yourself gotten the entire country to do

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Speaker 2: it and show that it actually works, where basically step

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Speaker 2: three and four start happening. And if you skip that

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Speaker 2: step two, it becomes a lot harder to do this

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Speaker 2: and especially scaling it across a geography with all these

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Speaker 2: time problems we were talking about.

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Speaker 3: Curious how your framework applies when new disruptive technologies enter

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Speaker 3: the overall ecosystem. And obviously the big elephant in the

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Speaker 3: room for every business is AI. Sanofi operates often in

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Speaker 3: regulated markets and geographies. And so how are you thinking

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Speaker 3: about leveraging AI internally?

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Speaker 2: So this is one of the hottest topics in this company,

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Speaker 2: just like in any other company. But indeed, to your point,

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Speaker 2: we have to be extra careful. The products we sell

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Speaker 2: You know, there’s a whole protocol and a whole thing

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Speaker 2: behind it because it basically touches consumer health rights.

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Speaker 1: We have to be very careful.

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Speaker 2: But anyway, across these eight levers, which I can disclose,

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Speaker 2: AI applies everywhere. So we can apply this to content creation,

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Speaker 2: spending our media in a proper site, demand forecasting. All

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Speaker 2: these things have a big AI angle to it. What

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Speaker 2: we’ve basically done as a company, kind of back to

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Speaker 2: my step two, we’ve identified three places. I can give

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Speaker 2: you one of them. where we’re basically just going to

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Speaker 2: do it. We’re just going to apply it and see

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Speaker 2: if it works, where it works. And if it does,

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Speaker 2: we’re going to scale it up or iterate it until

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Speaker 2: we can. So very close to your heart, Sarah, we’re

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Speaker 2: going to try and AI generate PDPs for certain platforms,

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Speaker 2: trying to see what AI can do with certain rules

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Speaker 2: we give it.

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Speaker 1: We can’t just claim anything.

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Speaker 2: We can’t just also generate every title, but just basically

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Speaker 2: with the certain output we get from the Amazons and

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Speaker 2: the coupons as a result, what is the optimal PDP

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Speaker 2: we can create? And the early results are very, very promising.

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Speaker 2: There’s still a lot of manual work in there, not

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Speaker 2: just because of regulatory things, but also because we have

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Speaker 2: to be consistent on our brands. We have to make

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Speaker 2: sure that certain language goes the right way.

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Speaker 1: Even the algorithms of these platforms are still changing, right?

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Speaker 2: So we have to make sure that whatever works for

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Speaker 2: whatever algorithm is still the right thing created by the AI,

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Speaker 2: but probably 60, 70, 80% of the whole value chain

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Speaker 2: can almost be replaced by either an LLM or something

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Speaker 2: that’s already on the market, which is very interesting.

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Speaker 3: And so in your mind, if 60% of the work

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Speaker 3: becomes more automated, does that allow you to reduce headcount?

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Speaker 3: remove vendors? How do you think about it from a

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Speaker 3: cost-saving standpoint?

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Speaker 4: He is not removing vendors. I’m sorry. This isn’t a

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Speaker 4: conversation we’re having today. Boys and girls, we’re all good.

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Speaker 4: Thanks very much.

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Speaker 5: All right.

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Speaker 4: This has been an excellent episode. Thanks for listening.

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Speaker 1: We’ll take this offline.

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Speaker 5: No.

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Speaker 2: This is e-commerce. It’s a lot of the growth of

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Speaker 2: a company like this. So we’re still in the phase

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Speaker 2: where we can reinvest into growth. The backlog, the long

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Speaker 2: list of ideas is quite large. So I think in

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Speaker 2: the short to mid-future, while we’re trying to test out

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Speaker 2: this technology. But the moment we get some bottom line gains,

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Speaker 2: we have plenty of spaces to reinvest into. But if

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Speaker 2: you want a future, future answer, we’re going to go

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Speaker 2: way outside of e-commerce. This is not like the first

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Speaker 2: industrial revolution, right? We’re going to go into a place

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Speaker 2: where not all work is replaced by other work. No,

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Speaker 2: there’s going to be more efficient ways of doing the

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Speaker 2: same thing. The good news is the consumer will win

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Speaker 2: because of this. I’m convinced that this path of least

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Speaker 2: of resistance will be found, then that will be the

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Speaker 2: benefit of the consumer. But as humankind, we have to

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Speaker 2: solve the other part. So how do we create a

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Speaker 2: system in which we can still make sure that all

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Speaker 2: of us have a healthy and happy and fulfilling life,

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Speaker 2: despite the whole role of work and the investments we

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Speaker 2: can make changing as we speak?

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Speaker 1: This is probably a different podcast, by the way. We

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Speaker 1: can do that in another call.

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Speaker 3: Well, Bas, we have to ask you our famous last question,

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Speaker 3: which is, what’s the bravest thing you’ve ever done?

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Speaker 2: So you pre-sent me this question, right? So I had

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Speaker 2: a hard think about it. And of course, the list

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Speaker 2: was gigantic.

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Speaker 1: No, no, I’m kidding. I’ll keep this professional.

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Speaker 2: What I did, I quit a very, very comfortable job

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Speaker 2: at the largest retailer of the Benelux in the East

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Speaker 2: Coast of the US almost 50 years ago to go

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Speaker 2: into this world of e-commerce and digital. And I remember

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Speaker 2: being laughed at by big manufacturers that now offer me jobs.

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Speaker 2: And I couldn’t even find a job. I started my

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Speaker 2: own company as a solution. So I started a company

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Speaker 2: because no one would offer me an e-commerce job at

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Speaker 2: that time. I was already almost married then. I had

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Speaker 2: a mortgage and everything, right? So I took a big

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Speaker 2: leap of faith, listening to myself, who I am, but

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Speaker 2: also what I thought the future would look like.

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Speaker 1: And I’ve been… Happy I made that jump ever since, right?

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Speaker 1: And I hope it will continue.

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Speaker 3: Well, your entrepreneurial spirit is clear as well at Sanofi.

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Speaker 3: And thank you so much for your time.

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Speaker 1: Thank you.

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Speaker 3: If you enjoyed this episode and you really want to

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Speaker 3: see how quickly Sanofi is evolving, We recorded an episode

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Speaker 3: a little ways back with Jean Cien, who works with

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00:20:54,880 –> 00:20:57,730
Speaker 3: us every single day. And then if you want to

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Speaker 3: think about global commerce and take it from a totally

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00:21:00,410 –> 00:21:03,949
Speaker 3: different angle and category, you can go listen to our

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00:21:03,990 –> 00:21:06,930
Speaker 3: friend Boris from Henkel. If you’re enjoying what you’re hearing,

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00:21:06,990 –> 00:21:10,719
Speaker 3: write a review, tell folks on LinkedIn. Thanks for listening.

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Speaker 6: Hi, I’m Jackie Cooper, Global Chief Brand Officer at Edelman

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Speaker 6: and the host of Touch of Truth, a new podcast

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Speaker 6: launching on the Adweek Podcast Network. My dad gave me

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Speaker 6: this incredibly smart piece of advice. Meet everyone once. As

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Speaker 6: a result, I’ve met some of the most fascinating and

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Speaker 6: inspiring people on the planet. Now on Touch of Truth,

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Speaker 6: we’re coming centre stage and sharing the mic to experience

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Speaker 6: stories of truth, insights and visions for the future that

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Speaker 6: will challenge your way of thinking. Touch of Truth is

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Speaker 6: available wherever you listen to podcasts. New episodes come out

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Speaker 6: every Tuesday. I do hope to see you there.